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Kelli/Mom
StuckOnPeas
PeaNut 21,316
September 2001
Posts: 2,626
Layouts: 29
 |  Posted: 1/20/2013 8:53:14 PM
We're sitting here watching the game, and my guys start talking about how Ray Lewis got away with murder in 2000. I had no idea! He took a plea bargain and settled civil suits with the two families.
I feel naive. | |
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freecharlie
Is the pool open yet?
PeaNut 109,127
September 2003
Posts: 19,232
Layouts: 4
Loc: Colorado
 | Posted: 1/20/2013 8:56:55 PM
He plead to obstruction of justice and agreed to testify against the other two. There was blood in his limo and his Superbowl outfit disappeared.
I'd be he did it or was somehow involved and it makes me sick at how the press loves him. |
| Tribbey: I believe, as long as Justice Dreifort is intolerant toward gays, lesbians, blacks, unions, women, poor people, and the first, fourth, fifth, and ninth amendments, I will remain intolerant toward him! [to Ainsley] Nice meeting you | |
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*maureen*
Bad Wolf
PeaNut 191,892
February 2005
Posts: 5,300
Layouts: 0
Loc: Wheaton
 | Posted: 1/20/2013 8:58:17 PM
He took a plea bargain for obstruction of justice and the murder charges against him were dropped. He testified against his friends but they were found not guilty. He settled to make the case go away. He has done a lot for the community since then and I think to suggest that he is a murderer under these circumstances is a bit off base. | |
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gypsyz3
Beach Bum Pea
PeaNut 2,013
November 1999
Posts: 8,867
Layouts: 25
Loc: Miami, FL
 | Posted: 1/20/2013 9:00:43 PM
This was a local story. Unfortunately, during his college years, the University of Miami was known as Thug U. Ray Lewis really was with the wrong people. All charges were dropped against him because he testified against his friends. His friends were eventually acquitted.
After that incident, Lewis cut all contact with his college buddies and cleaned up his act. |
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WingNut
Best Cat Evahhh!
PeaNut 18,741
July 2001
Posts: 13,079
Layouts: 200
Loc: Maryland
| Posted: 1/20/2013 9:03:58 PM
NO. He was in the vicinity of a stabbing that involved some people he knew. He was not involved but close enough to be considered involved. He testified against the perpetrators who were eventually acquitted.
He learned his lesson and walked away from those who were trying to bring him down. He is someone who saw where is bad choices were taking him, took responsibility for them, and decided he wanted a different life. And in the 10+ years since, he has led an exlemperary (sp?) life.
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Joy
"And a Christian who constantly complains, fails to be a good Christian: they become Mr. or Mrs. Whiner, no?" - Pope Francis"
Into the Thicklebit- My new favorite blog/webcomic!
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mzza111
PeaAddict
PeaNut 57,891
December 2002
Posts: 1,648
Layouts: 2
Loc: Orange County, CA
 | Posted: 1/20/2013 9:09:20 PM
YES he IS a murderer! It's disgusting to see anyone defend that piece of $hit!
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freecharlie
Is the pool open yet?
PeaNut 109,127
September 2003
Posts: 19,232
Layouts: 4
Loc: Colorado
| Posted: 1/20/2013 9:09:31 PM
He has done a lot for the community since then and I think to suggest that he is a murderer under these circumstances is a bit off base.
I don't think the first part of your sentence has anything to do with the second part.
Just because there wasn't enough to convict the friends, doesn't automatically mean any of them were innocent.
Lewis may not have been the one who stabbed the men, or he might have. We'll never know. But he was there. |
| Tribbey: I believe, as long as Justice Dreifort is intolerant toward gays, lesbians, blacks, unions, women, poor people, and the first, fourth, fifth, and ninth amendments, I will remain intolerant toward him! [to Ainsley] Nice meeting you | |
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scrap-up
PeaNut
PeaNut 16,299
June 2001
Posts: 264
Layouts: 2
Loc: Milwaukee, WI
| Posted: 1/20/2013 9:11:15 PM
IMO he was more involved in the situation than he admitted to. I believe he tried to cover his ass and did what he needed to to squeak through with no jail time, a few fines and his job intact. In my mind he got away with murder.
Having said that, in the last ten years he definately has turned his life around and has done good things in the community. He is lucky that he got that second chance. |
Julie
Mom to a Peanut, a Slugger, and a Boo. | |
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spawithsonia
PeaNut
PeaNut 286,992
December 2006
Posts: 158
Layouts: 0
 | Posted: 1/20/2013 9:15:31 PM
His white suit covered in blood was never recovered and he was fined by the nfl | |
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*maureen*
Bad Wolf
PeaNut 191,892
February 2005
Posts: 5,300
Layouts: 0
Loc: Wheaton
| Posted: 1/20/2013 9:18:03 PM
His white suit covered in blood was never recovered and he was fined by the nfl
He was fined by the NFL because he plead guilty to obstruction of justice. | |
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ketsmom
PeaAddict
PeaNut 489,418
November 2010
Posts: 1,561
Layouts: 0
 | Posted: 1/20/2013 9:24:28 PM
I agree it makes me sick that anyone can defend him. At the very least he is good friends with thugs and criminals. At the worst h participated in a murder. Either way, he doesn't deserve the great life he's been given. | |
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*KAS*
Ancient Ancestor of Pea
PeaNut 408,684
January 2009
Posts: 6,735
Layouts: 0
Loc: Georgia girl
 | Posted: 1/20/2013 10:00:36 PM
NO. He was in the vicinity of a stabbing that involved some people he knew. He was not involved but close enough to be considered involved. He testified against the perpetrators who were eventually acquitted.
Well, sort of. They were not just 'people he knew.' They were his friends, and traveling with him in the limo he rented that night. It was his group, not just acquaintances he saw out at the club.
Where's his outfit from that night? What happened to the girl who was in their group who said that they stopped to dispose of his bloody clothes? Why did he pay the families millions to keep quiet? Why did he lie to the cops? Why didn't they bother calling all of the witnesses? Why didn't they investigate further after two people were murdered? It just quietly faded away....
He sat WITH his friends for the first two weeks of the trial. He turned on them so he could get the murder charges dropped. If he wasn't at all involved and really just tried to break the fight up, why did he get the maximum sentence for a first time offender?
Luckily for all of them (but not so much for the victims), the DA did a crap job on the case, and they all walked. I understand that you want to believe that he had no involvement, as a Ravens fan. That's understandable. And I'm glad he's done good things with his life SINCE that night, but I think the fact that he's lauded as some sort of media darling and NFL saint now that he's retiring is disgusting. Especially when somebody like Tony Gonzalez retiring is virtually ignored. |
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KELLI
Had to delete my old account, but I've been here since July 2006! | |
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busypea
boring + nerdy
PeaNut 52,817
October 2002
Posts: 25,146
Layouts: 145
Loc: Oregon
| Posted: 1/20/2013 10:36:37 PM
What *KAS* said.
I can't stand Ray Lewis and the idolatry makes me sck. | |
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TinCin
Ancient Ancestor of Pea
PeaNut 29,331
February 2002
Posts: 6,212
Layouts: 0
Loc: Living in the palm of the hand.
| Posted: 1/21/2013 3:23:30 AM
OMG - an athlete involved in illegal activities that somehow got minimal punishment and all is forgiven. Let me go see if I can find anyone in this country that is surprised by that statement. It may take me a while so feel free to continue on without me. |
| PROUD MEMBER OF UAW LOCAL 659 - Home of the Sit-Down Strike! | |
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sheepjammies
BucketHead
PeaNut 119,276
December 2003
Posts: 879
Layouts: 14
| Posted: 1/21/2013 4:18:26 AM
I with 2peas had a "like" button for comments! there are several here that I would "like"! | |
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Nancie52
StuckOnPeas
PeaNut 452,927
January 2010
Posts: 2,910
Layouts: 23
Loc: Mass
 | Posted: 1/21/2013 5:41:49 AM
I can't stand him either...what. a disgrace... and that's all we'll here about for the next two weeks...  | |
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Christine58
pea'rific teacher Union President
PeaNut 164,125
August 2004
Posts: 21,106
Layouts: 0
Loc: Western NY
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maryannscraps
Ancient Ancestor of Pea
PeaNut 75,215
March 2003
Posts: 6,370
Layouts: 2
Loc: massachusetts
| Posted: 1/21/2013 8:10:20 AM
Wow, I didn't know that story KAS. Who was murdered?
I'm glad he turned his life around, but I had no idea that had happened. | |
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guzismom
Ancient Ancestor of Pea
PeaNut 31,617
March 2002
Posts: 9,334
Layouts: 59
Loc: southern new mexico
| Posted: 1/21/2013 8:17:10 AM
Our system of justice did not charge him with murder. He has since denounced that group of friends and cleaned up his life. I respect him for that.
But the peas will never forgive...they love to beat the dead horses. And they think they know more than the cops, prosecutors, judges, etc.
Ray Lewis will be NFL Hall of Fame before you know it! |
Marilyn (now in New Mexico!!)
SCUBA diving and SCRAPPING Mom of two
Canon 5DMkII, 24-70 2.8L; 70-200 2.8L IS, 50 1.4;
my blog | |
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joyce22
PeaAddict
PeaNut 140,960
April 2004
Posts: 1,143
Layouts: 0
| Posted: 1/21/2013 8:25:02 AM
As I recall from the various reporting in Atlanta the guys were harrassing the Lewis party. My feeling is they (the other guys) wanted trouble. I'm sure they thought they could get some money if someone in the Lewis party punched them. They got more than they bargained for that night. | |
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*KAS*
Ancient Ancestor of Pea
PeaNut 408,684
January 2009
Posts: 6,735
Layouts: 0
Loc: Georgia girl
| Posted: 1/21/2013 8:44:26 AM
Our system of justice did not charge him with murder. He has since denounced that group of friends and cleaned up his life. I respect him for that.
But the peas will never forgive...they love to beat the dead horses. And they think they know more than the cops, prosecutors, judges, etc.
Ray Lewis will be NFL Hall of Fame before you know it!
---------
He WAS charged with murder, actually. Two counts, as well as 4 other felony charges. He had lawyers that were able to negotiate a plea bargain where the murder charges would be dropped, if he testified against his friends.
I don't need to 'forgive' him for anything, and it's the first time I've ever commented on Ray Lewis on this board, so it's hardly beating a dead horse. I'm sure you would feel different if your family member was the victim. Like the little 12 year old girl whose dad was murdered before she was born.
But yes, let's all get excited to celebrate his induction into the hall of fame!
The victims were Richard Lollar and Jacinth Baker. |
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KELLI
Had to delete my old account, but I've been here since July 2006! | |
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tamhugh
Ancient Ancestor of Pea
PeaNut 12,875
March 2001
Posts: 7,883
Layouts: 11
 | Posted: 1/21/2013 9:05:50 AM
Luckily for all of them (but not so much for the victims), the DA did a crap job on the case, and they all walked. I understand that you want to believe that he had no involvement, as a Ravens fan. That's understandable. And I'm glad he's done good things with his life SINCE that night, but I think the fact that he's lauded as some sort of media darling and NFL saint now that he's retiring is disgusting. Especially when somebody like Tony Gonzalez retiring is virtually ignored.
I have no opinion of the Ravens, one way or another, but this hits so true for me. I think the thing that bothers me the most is that some of my friends who say that Lewis has done such a great job of turning his life around and laud him are the same ones who think Mike Vick (whom I can not stand) should never be allowed to play football or make a living again. While I believe they both got the punishment the courts agreed to, and they have the right to play, I can't admire either of them or cheer them on. | |
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Quinlove
BucketHead
PeaNut 30,457
February 2002
Posts: 847
Layouts: 2
Loc: Texas
| Posted: 1/21/2013 9:17:12 AM
When the Ravens were playing the Broncos last weekend, I was on the phone with a friend. She was saying... who do I want to win this game (which was such an exciting game!) - the murderer or the Pope ??? Sadly, the Pope's team lost. |
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sewsew1
BucketHead
PeaNut 429,768
July 2009
Posts: 651
Layouts: 0
| Posted: 1/21/2013 9:17:38 AM
I too am local to the area where the murder was committed. I truly believe he is guilty of murder.
He PAID OFF the families in a plea bargain. Why would you pay off people if you truly were innocent of the crime of which you were accused?????
I too believe that it is sickeningly disgusting to see how the media glorifies someone who robbed someone of their life and got away with it because he was rich.
But don't get me started on why the families involved were willing to accept MONEY instead of seeking justice for their loss. |
Ann Marie
Sometimes seamstress sometimes cardmaker ALWAYS a Mom
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mzza111
PeaAddict
PeaNut 57,891
December 2002
Posts: 1,648
Layouts: 2
Loc: Orange County, CA
| Posted: 1/21/2013 9:24:15 AM
Ray Lewis will be NFL Hall of Fame before you know it!
Yeah, along with OJ, ANOTHER murder!
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TinaFB
the lunatics have taken over the asylum
PeaNut 25,135
November 2001
Posts: 25,623
Layouts: 349
Loc: Maryland
| Posted: 1/21/2013 9:27:22 AM
I live in the Baltimore area too and am not a fan of Ray Lewis. It irritates me to no end that one of the local Christian radio stations keeps putting graphics of him and his latest favorite psalm on facebook. I fully believe in forgiveness and redemption, but the guy seems like he doesn't walk the talk that he's preaching. |
Tina
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Nightowl scrapper
Intl Assoc of Epic Length Posters - USA Chapter
PeaNut 103,889
August 2003
Posts: 24,760
Layouts: 0
Loc: Colorado
| Posted: 1/21/2013 9:30:11 AM
But don't get me started on why the families involved were willing to accept MONEY instead of seeking justice for their loss.
Sometimes with a high profile suspect and an inept DA, the only punishment you can get from the perp is some money out of his pocket. Don't be too hard on the families when you don't know the circumstances they were presented with. |
"Until you put a thought into words, clearly and precisely, it is not a thought at all. It is a kind of fog rolling around inside the skull."
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Quinlove
BucketHead
PeaNut 30,457
February 2002
Posts: 847
Layouts: 2
Loc: Texas
| Posted: 1/21/2013 9:31:18 AM
Please tell me that OJ is not in the Hall. I do know that he is in prison. (so he finally is where he belongs) |
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Quinlove
BucketHead
PeaNut 30,457
February 2002
Posts: 847
Layouts: 2
Loc: Texas
| Posted: 1/21/2013 9:32:59 AM
Nightowl - ITA |
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Christine58
pea'rific teacher Union President
PeaNut 164,125
August 2004
Posts: 21,106
Layouts: 0
Loc: Western NY
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Quinlove
BucketHead
PeaNut 30,457
February 2002
Posts: 847
Layouts: 2
Loc: Texas
| Posted: 1/21/2013 10:36:41 AM
O.M.G. Did not know that... Makes sense I guess... I was at the Detroit game where he beat the record... the scoreboard was going nuts with GO OJ!!! and he was on the other team... very exciting... but then it went all wrong... so sad. |
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peanuttle
PeaAddict
PeaNut 136,677
March 2004
Posts: 1,047
Layouts: 0
| Posted: 1/21/2013 10:42:28 AM
Well, sort of. They were not just 'people he knew.' They were his friends, and traveling with him in the limo he rented that night. It was his group, not just acquaintances he saw out at the club.
Where's his outfit from that night? What happened to the girl who was in their group who said that they stopped to dispose of his bloody clothes? Why did he pay the families millions to keep quiet? Why did he lie to the cops? Why didn't they bother calling all of the witnesses? Why didn't they investigate further after two people were murdered? It just quietly faded away....
He sat WITH his friends for the first two weeks of the trial. He turned on them so he could get the murder charges dropped. If he wasn't at all involved and really just tried to break the fight up, why did he get the maximum sentence for a first time offender?
Luckily for all of them (but not so much for the victims), the DA did a crap job on the case, and they all walked. I understand that you want to believe that he had no involvement, as a Ravens fan. That's understandable. And I'm glad he's done good things with his life SINCE that night, but I think the fact that he's lauded as some sort of media darling and NFL saint now that he's retiring is disgusting. Especially when somebody like Tony Gonzalez retiring is virtually ignored.
I couldn't agree more with the above. I am happy for the Ravens as a team, but am disgusted to have to watch Ray Lewis and how the reports talk about him. | |
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guzismom
Ancient Ancestor of Pea
PeaNut 31,617
March 2002
Posts: 9,334
Layouts: 59
Loc: southern new mexico
| Posted: 1/21/2013 11:02:15 AM
I'm sure you would feel different if your family member was the victim.
You're right....I would. And I would not be accepting settlements and agreeing not to talk as one condition of the settlement. I would be demanding justice for my dead family member.
My point is, Mr. Lewis was not convicted of murder. The DA likely knew there was no case against him and so went for what he thought he COULD get, a case against the person/people who actually did the crime. Unfortunately for the victims, he was not successful.
it's the first time I've ever commented on Ray Lewis on this board, so it's hardly beating a dead horse.
Then perhaps I was not referring to you... |
Marilyn (now in New Mexico!!)
SCUBA diving and SCRAPPING Mom of two
Canon 5DMkII, 24-70 2.8L; 70-200 2.8L IS, 50 1.4;
my blog | |
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jenp1024
Ancient Ancestor of Pea
PeaNut 51,697
October 2002
Posts: 5,991
Layouts: 9
Loc: Connecticut
| Posted: 1/21/2013 11:05:46 AM
I was wondering why people were yelling "murderer" at the game last night. I didn't know that about Ray Lewis.
Either way, he doesn't deserve the great life he's been given.
I don't think that any of us are qualified to judge who deserves a good life and who doesn't. While you have your opinions on his guilt, you don't KNOW his involvement. | |
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jodster70
To the right, To the right
PeaNut 51,257
October 2002
Posts: 5,549
Layouts: 28
Loc: Usually NSBR, an un"pea"dictable place :)
| Posted: 1/21/2013 11:10:42 AM
After how Art Modell screwed the city of Cleveland...can't cheer for the Ravens. I am also sick of the Ray Lewis Love Fest....Go NINERS....
I can so relate to this statement, because as an Oilers fan, I was really upset about what happened when Bud Adams brought the team to Tennessee.
I will say, at least the Browns got to keep their name. Bud Adams took the Oilers name with him to Tennessee.
I was already rooting for the Niners, but that just gives me another reason to do so. |
**Jody**
"The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government -- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests."
Patrick Henry | |
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Maryland
Ancient Ancestor of Pea
PeaNut 87,597
May 2003
Posts: 8,789
Layouts: 0
| Posted: 1/21/2013 11:15:56 AM
Thank you Guzismom! I agree with what you said.
I am very happy for the Ravens! I do see why the people of Cleveland would be upset with their team leaving. It happens way to much in pro sports. But at least if they didn't like Modell, then maybe them leaving and getting a new team with their name was good? Baltimore lost the Colts, so their fans understand. At least Baltimore renamed the team instead of taking the name from Cleveland. | |
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Edgy Coolness
PeaFixture
PeaNut 365,853
March 2008
Posts: 3,514
Layouts: 0
Loc: Dallas, Texas
 | Posted: 1/21/2013 11:17:40 AM
Wow! My friend's son was drunk and passed out in the back of a car (he was a teenage alcoholic and now recovering) and got 10 years for "just being there" (the gang law) when the front seat passenger, a 16 year old, pulled out a gun and shot and killed the people he was fighting with.
My friend's son got the harshest and lengthiest sentence because he was 18 years old while the shooter did 2 years in Juvie because he was not as did the other 3 boys in the car.
And no, none of them were gang members, just kids out for a joy ride that ended in a tragedy because the shooter couldn't figure out to solve his problems without the use of a gun.
So, I'm not surprised that Ray Lewis is proof that if you have enough money, fame, and the "right" team, you won't be punished for your earthly crimes.
Lady Justice is not blind to fame and money or has she ever been. |
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Jenny Lilac
For Esme with Love and Squalor
PeaNut 45,964
August 2002
Posts: 11,621
Layouts: 276
Loc: Pioneer Valley, Massachusetts
| Posted: 1/21/2013 12:02:21 PM
They were not acquitted because they didn't do it, they were acquitted on the basis of it being self defense. |
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**JoJam**
Peace Out Girl Scout
PeaNut 80,420
April 2003
Posts: 9,839
Layouts: 75
Loc: monitoring lucy
| Posted: 1/21/2013 1:23:23 PM
I was watching old reruns of Law & Order this morning--there was an episode in which Ray Lewis (among other pro athletes) was mentioned (the episode was about a baseball player who killed a limo driver.) Anyway, they kept saying, "Special rules for people with special talents." |
ttfnjoanna
***********
"Like what you do, do what you like."--Life is Good
"I've made some empty promises in my life. That was by far the most generous." Micheal Scott. | |
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shannoninkc
PeaAddict
PeaNut 304,038
March 2007
Posts: 1,354
Layouts: 0
Loc: Where you vacation.
| Posted: 1/21/2013 1:45:40 PM
Isn't he the guy who has some show where camera's followed him around for a year? A football life or something? My 8 year old boy, who loves all things football, (except Tim Tebow) seems to really like Ray Lewis, based on the show. He talks about him quite a bit. I had no idea about his past. I'll have to ask my football obsessed husband about it. | |
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Christine58
pea'rific teacher Union President
PeaNut 164,125
August 2004
Posts: 21,106
Layouts: 0
Loc: Western NY
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simplekelly
Loving Life
PeaNut 142,378
April 2004
Posts: 16,334
Layouts: 6
Loc: Why do you want to know?
| Posted: 1/21/2013 3:20:03 PM
OMG - an athlete involved in illegal activities that somehow got minimal punishment and all is forgiven. Let me go see if I can find anyone in this country that is surprised by that statement. It may take me a while so feel free to continue on without me.
buahahahaha LMFAO! sadly that is true. |
best,
**Live your dreams, not your fears** | |
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mrgiedrnkr
PeaAddict
PeaNut 26,978
January 2002
Posts: 1,227
Layouts: 117
Loc: Omaha, Nebraska
| Posted: 1/21/2013 3:26:51 PM
ShannoninKC - he was on HBO's Hard Knocks a long time ago. Maybe that is what you are thinking of? I saw him on there and really liked him. I had no idea about his background.
Stacy | |
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guzismom
Ancient Ancestor of Pea
PeaNut 31,617
March 2002
Posts: 9,334
Layouts: 59
Loc: southern new mexico
| Posted: 1/21/2013 4:32:29 PM
6 kids by 4 different women....great role model.
A lot of people, famous and not-so-famous, can say the same thing. What is your point?
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Marilyn (now in New Mexico!!)
SCUBA diving and SCRAPPING Mom of two
Canon 5DMkII, 24-70 2.8L; 70-200 2.8L IS, 50 1.4;
my blog | |
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froggy one
PeaAddict
PeaNut 479,242
August 2010
Posts: 1,092
Layouts: 0
Loc: In my own mind
| Posted: 1/21/2013 4:40:01 PM
Our justice system acquitted him. That was their choice based on the circumstances. I admire the person he has become. Go Ravens! |
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tracylynn
StuckOnPeas
PeaNut 54,403
November 2002
Posts: 2,532
Layouts: 0
Loc: Washington State
| Posted: 1/21/2013 6:23:08 PM
Well, sort of. They were not just 'people he knew.' They were his friends, and traveling with him in the limo he rented that night. It was his group, not just acquaintances he saw out at the club.
Where's his outfit from that night? What happened to the girl who was in their group who said that they stopped to dispose of his bloody clothes? Why did he pay the families millions to keep quiet? Why did he lie to the cops? Why didn't they bother calling all of the witnesses? Why didn't they investigate further after two people were murdered? It just quietly faded away....
He sat WITH his friends for the first two weeks of the trial. He turned on them so he could get the murder charges dropped. If he wasn't at all involved and really just tried to break the fight up, why did he get the maximum sentence for a first time offender?
Luckily for all of them (but not so much for the victims), the DA did a crap job on the case, and they all walked. I understand that you want to believe that he had no involvement, as a Ravens fan. That's understandable. And I'm glad he's done good things with his life SINCE that night, but I think the fact that he's lauded as some sort of media darling and NFL saint now that he's retiring is disgusting. Especially when somebody like Tony Gonzalez retiring is virtually ignored.
Word for word.
It amazes me that there are so many people willing to defend him. Though based on how the press has behaved towards him the last few weeks, it shouldn't surprise me. |
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Nightowl scrapper
Intl Assoc of Epic Length Posters - USA Chapter
PeaNut 103,889
August 2003
Posts: 24,760
Layouts: 0
Loc: Colorado
| Posted: 1/21/2013 6:37:12 PM
Well, I had no idea of any of this history. Very interesting. Now I have another reason to root for the 49'ers besides the fact that the Ravens beat the Broncos to get to the Super Bowl. |
"Until you put a thought into words, clearly and precisely, it is not a thought at all. It is a kind of fog rolling around inside the skull."
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Susie Pea
PeaAddict
PeaNut 433,822
August 2009
Posts: 1,415
Layouts: 0
| Posted: 1/21/2013 6:40:56 PM
6 kids by 4 different women....great role model.
A lot of people, famous and not-so-famous, can say the same thing. What is your point?
I think her point is, he's a bad role model. | |
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