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PurposeDrivenPea
PeaAddict
PeaNut 66,365
February 2003
Posts: 1,132
Layouts: 231
Loc: SW Michigan
 |  Posted: 1/28/2013 10:06:57 AM
A little back story...three years ago my husband left his corporate, good paying job because he was miserable. He took his pension money and opened a retail store. The first couple of years the business did fairly well but this last year we aren't breaking even and go into debt more and more. We are always 2 months behind on our home mortgage with foreclosure looming, pay our utilities at shut off notice time, buy food for our family daily if we make money at our store that day, and owe thousands in bills for our store. On top of this, my husband is starting a new business that he has been using money that we may get towards, instead of paying off our bills. I hate arguing so I say very little to him about it but the stress is building up in me. When I have spoken to others about this, like my eldest daughter, she thinks my husband should continue putting money into this other business. I am starting to wonder if I am in the wrong thinking he shouldn't be doing this? What say the Peas?
My thoughts are we should sell the inventory of our store and go out of business to pay off bills, get caught up on our personal bills, I would then get employment elsewhere instead of working in our store daily, and my husband could then start this new business venture. |
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SDeven
Love Letters Pea
PeaNut 65,852
January 2003
Posts: 28,217
Layouts: 380
Loc: Nashville, TN!
| Posted: 1/28/2013 10:21:54 AM
The ship is sinking and you don't want to argue? Does your husband have a CPA?
Seriously. It's time for a come to Jesus meeting. |
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scrappin jen
PeaAddict
PeaNut 111,615
October 2003
Posts: 1,348
Layouts: 0
 | Posted: 1/28/2013 10:26:17 AM
You may be allowing him to drive the bus but it seems its time for a reality check. The situation you described is falling off the cliff. What happens if one of you gets sick or injured you'd be sunk. It is time to head for higher ground and get back on course. | |
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Nightowl scrapper
Intl Assoc of Epic Length Posters - USA Chapter
PeaNut 103,889
August 2003
Posts: 24,823
Layouts: 0
Loc: Colorado
| Posted: 1/28/2013 10:26:29 AM
It is never morally right to shirk your commitments. That is what your dh is doing when he stays behind on the mortgage, just a step from foreclosure, and doesn't pay utilities on time. This isn't just a morally wrong way to live your life - it's stupid. Your credit rating must be a mess.
I can tell you from personal experience with a family member who endured similar financial stress that bottling up your feelings and continuing to walk a financial tightrope may land one of you (probably you) in the hospital with a major health issue.
Do you have a CPA that handles your taxes (I hope!)? If you don't, get one. While this is crappy time of year to go to a new one, it's imperative that you get a knowlegeable 3rd party involved, and a CPA is what you need.
You need to sit down with a qualified CPA and have a reality check meeting for your dh. You need a job that pays your bills and gets your credit rating back in shape (and trust me, the damage he has done will take a LONG time to repair).
Yes, a business that is draining you needs to be sold, either as an entity or just the inventory, but the CPA can advise on the appropriate course to take.
It's all well and good to follow your bliss, but you and dh are first and foremost adults who have a responsibility to manage finances in and adult manner. If that means both of you working for someone else for a few years while you get out of debt, and saving up to have appropriate reserves for owning a business (and I suspect you did not when you purchased the store), then that's what you do.
Life isnt always about what makes you happy. What should make you happy is doing the right thing in all circumstances. I'm very sorry your dh didn't learn that lesson. Oh, and don't take advice from your dd - she didn't learn about adult responsibilities and credit ratings either, apparently. |
"Until you put a thought into words, clearly and precisely, it is not a thought at all. It is a kind of fog rolling around inside the skull."
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benem
Yo, that's fifty dollars for a T-shirt.
PeaNut 526,154
October 2011
Posts: 5,563
Layouts: 0
Loc: Illinois
 | Posted: 1/28/2013 10:26:30 AM
The question for me is, what plan does your husband have to increase the income/profit from the retail business? How long does he plan to sink money into it and put your family at risk?
If he has a plan and forsees this as a temporary issue then you could discuss exactly how long your family is going to limp along while he turns it around.
But if this is just the way it's going to be then you both need to discuss a plan.
If you want to talk to him about it, I would start off by saying you are scared. Scared for you and your family. He needs to know you are not ok with this. He needs to know you are willing to give him time to turn it around, but there;s a deadline and what is the plan. |
"We are NSBR. We talk about E-V-E-R-Y-T-H-I-N-G.
Diva Cups Merkins Tub Girl Crock Pots Kitten Heels The Hoff HOF Obama Bush Kardashians Shopping Carts Shopping Trolleys Dead Aunt Cookies Trolls Not Trolls Garden Snakes Snails Stripper Poles with or with out Birds In-Laws Scoff-Laws Blogs Borg Paint Colors Dinner Books and Each Other"
--SueSume, 3/21/13
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*maureen*
Bad Wolf
PeaNut 191,892
February 2005
Posts: 5,316
Layouts: 0
Loc: Wheaton
 | Posted: 1/28/2013 10:30:44 AM
When I have spoken to others about this, like my eldest daughter, she thinks my husband should continue putting money into this other business. I am starting to wonder if I am in the wrong thinking he shouldn't be doing this?
Your husband is running a failing business and instead of talking to him about it and the effects it has on your family you're talking to your daughter? You need to sit him down today and figure out how you are going to manage this financial mess you two have gotten into. He can't be starting another business with this one falling apart because it will surely be the death knell of the first business. I also wouldn't be letting my husband risk my financial future given his poor track record with running businesses. | |
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PurposeDrivenPea
PeaAddict
PeaNut 66,365
February 2003
Posts: 1,132
Layouts: 231
Loc: SW Michigan
| Posted: 1/28/2013 10:35:05 AM
Okay. Now that I know that I am not alone in thinking that this isn't right, I will discuss with him more and hopefully it won't escalate into an argument. He knows that I am scared. I told him that a couple of months ago. He just wants me to have faith in him. We do have a CPA that comes in to our store twice a month to file our state sales tax reports, does our profit & loss statements, files our personal and business yearly taxes, etc. She knows that we are in the hole with our store bills, and she knows that dh is starting a new business. The only thing she doesn't know is that we are behind in our personal bills every month. She works for herself so maybe she isn't knowledgeable/confident enough to say anything to us? Or maybe she just doesn't think it is any of her business? I will talk with her and set up a meeting for the three of us to sit down.
Thanks for all of the advice peas! Wish me luck!  |
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Nightowl scrapper
Intl Assoc of Epic Length Posters - USA Chapter
PeaNut 103,889
August 2003
Posts: 24,823
Layouts: 0
Loc: Colorado
| Posted: 1/28/2013 10:43:51 AM
She works for herself so maybe she isn't knowledgeable/confident enough to say anything to us? Or maybe she just doesn't think it is any of her business? I will talk with her and set up a meeting for the three of us to sit down.
Nope, the fact that she works for herself is not relevant. Professionals do the scope of work you ask them to do, they do not delve into areas they weren't asked about, like your personal finances. By opining that you are screwing up your finances with this loser of a business venture, without being asked, your dh could easily fire her.
When you tell her "we need advice because as you know, our business is sinking, we're pumping money into a new business venture, and we are living hand to mouth daily and hoping not to be foreclosed on, how do we get out of this mess?" then you will have asked her to step into the quagmire in question and use her professional expertise to help you form a plan. She is a CPA, right? Not just a tax person? then yes, have a meeting with her. When you set it up, explain exactly what it is you are concerned about and exactly what kind of insight you want from her and that you need a plan of action to deal with all your finances, not just the quarterlies and annual tax returns. It's a different scope, so she needs to be clear on what you are asking to come out of this meeting.
Hopefully your dh is smart enough to listen to the voice of a professional assessing the entire picture of your finances.
Good luck. Such stresses will break not only your health but your marriage. The cost of this meeting is literally an investment in holding your marriage together. |
"Until you put a thought into words, clearly and precisely, it is not a thought at all. It is a kind of fog rolling around inside the skull."
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moveablefeast
do justice, love mercy
PeaNut 265,707
June 2006
Posts: 11,135
Layouts: 0
Loc: Northern Virginia
 | Posted: 1/28/2013 10:43:58 AM
I'm not going to tell you what to do, I'm just going to tell you what's going on in my life right now, and what I've learned from it, okay?
My parents are in their late 60s/early 70s. They owned their own businesses for decades. Some years were very prosperous and some years were very lean.
Eventually, the lean years outnumbered the good years. They took a mortgage on their house to pay business expenses. They did not carry health insurance at any time until they qualified for Medicare by age.
Several years ago, everything hit a crisis. The house needed a major repair, they could not buy heating oil and were cold, they had no reserves, their car broke down, and my mom lost her part time supplemental job. They were in ramen-noodle territory.
They are now living in a condo that my husband and I own, and the financial repercussions of their life choices have been far-reaching. They have NO reserves and NO backup plan, and they are both struggling to find and keep work, and the simple fact of the matter is that if they had cut their losses and gotten out 10 years ago, they may have been able to rebuild some stability but as it is, it got to a crisis and they have absolutely nothing to show for a lifetime of work.
I think entrepreneurship is awesome and know that not everyone is in a position to lose everything to the business like my folks did, and that some businesses are very successful. It's just that I have learned that you have to figure out what is going to succeed on the long term and what is not, and be willing to cut your losses when you're in the latter category. | |
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Shih Tzu Mommy
Million dollar camera, 10 dollar lock!
PeaNut 224,352
September 2005
Posts: 23,525
Layouts: 0
Loc: Right here
 | Posted: 1/28/2013 10:52:09 AM
The ship is sinking and you don't want to argue? Does your husband have a CPA?
Seriously. It's time for a come to Jesus meeting.
YES! |
Dog people are a special breed! | |
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busypea
boring + nerdy
PeaNut 52,817
October 2002
Posts: 25,217
Layouts: 145
Loc: Oregon
| Posted: 1/28/2013 10:56:38 AM
He needs to get his ass back to a job with a predictable income. If he's not happy, boo-freakin'-hoo. He has ruined your family financially for decades to come (he cashed out his pension to invest in the business - SERIOUSLY????) and no longer has the luxury of working for himself.
It is beyond selfish to put your family at risk like this so he can pursue one failed dream after another. Don't feel guilty for standing up for what's best for the family - he's the one who should be feeling guilty.
Not one more penny should go into that business. He needs to consult with a CPA and an attorney and decide the best way to exit the business. Bankruptcy may be the best option. I'm not an advocate of bankruptcy, but there are times when it's really the only choice. The picture you're painting makes it sound like this might be one of them.
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Nightowl scrapper
Intl Assoc of Epic Length Posters - USA Chapter
PeaNut 103,889
August 2003
Posts: 24,823
Layouts: 0
Loc: Colorado
| Posted: 1/28/2013 10:56:39 AM
Moveablefeast, you bring up an excellent point. It's not just what's going on now, it's what the OP and her dh are doing with their future.
I also had parents who were self-employed, in a number of ventures. Having a dream and the desire and ambition to earn money is not enough to run your own business successfully. Some people simply are not cut out for entrepreneurship. My parents were not. The results were tragic. They struggled about money their entire lives because they wouldn't accept that they needed to work for someone else. Guess what? in their retirement years, which were lean, my mother juggled credit cards until she couldn't, and a massive stroke brought on in part by the stress of financial problems she wouldn't discuss for fear of arguments has left her helpless for 16 years. Their problems had a profound effect on children and grandchildren.
OP, you have kids. Are they at home? Do they need stuff like clothes, funds for after school activities, do they hope to go to college? They don't need parents who 'just need a little more time' to be solvent. If they are grown and out of the house, and you are struggling financially at this point instead of saving for retirement and healthcare, you are almost certain to be relying on them in your golden years as moveablefeast's parents, and mine, ended up relying on their kids to survive.
Your problem is going to be convincing your dh that it's not all about his dream of being a wealthy and happy entrepreneur. His decisions impact everyone in the family, and may for decades to come if he keeps going on the path he's on. It's not a matter of you 'believing' in him. that's a crock. It's a matter of being a grownup and thinking about someone other than himself, because when he married and had children, that's exactly what he implicitly promised to do - put himself and his ambitions secondary to the well-being of those who depend on him.
I sincerely hope we've helped you see some other aspects to what he's doing besides his contention that you don't 'believe' in him. He may very well need counseling, individual and joint marriage counseling, to get completely back on track.  |
"Until you put a thought into words, clearly and precisely, it is not a thought at all. It is a kind of fog rolling around inside the skull."
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brab74
PeaFixture
PeaNut 455,916
February 2010
Posts: 3,634
Layouts: 15
Loc: Central Illinois
 | Posted: 1/28/2013 11:02:17 AM
I sincerely hope we've helped you see some other aspects to what he's doing besides his contention that you don't 'believe' in him. He may very well need counseling, individual and joint marriage counseling, to get completely back on track
I agree. Based on this thread and others you've posted in the past, you and your DH both need to seek professional help - either together or separately. I am really hoping that you do.
I don't think your DH should start another business venture - he should apply for a stable position. There won't be income flowing in from a new business venture - it is going to cost a lot to get something new started up, which is something that your family can't afford to do. | |
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Edgy Coolness
PeaFixture
PeaNut 365,853
March 2008
Posts: 3,514
Layouts: 0
Loc: Dallas, Texas
 | Posted: 1/28/2013 1:17:44 PM
Just a thought but maybe he could sell some of his "big boy toys" like his plane (you mentioned he owned one back in 2010 when he refused to allow you to give a gift to your "poor" sister) and put it towards your mortgage and borrow the money from his wealthy mother to cover the overages like food and utilities that your salary (I seem to remember a thread about him telling you to get a job to pay for those things) didn't cover and I didn't realize it meant you working for free in his business or only getting paid if the store made a profit.
Anyway, I concur that you should have some kind of meeting with your CPA and with or probably better without your husband to find out where you and your children NOT him financially and legally stand. |
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Annabella
Leads a Charmed Life
PeaNut 43,843
July 2002
Posts: 42,259
Layouts: 46
Loc: East Coast
| Posted: 1/28/2013 1:25:46 PM
No advice, just sorry you're dealing with this. Is there a professional you can show your 2 businesses to that ran run the numbers and give you an unbias opinion on what your next step should be? |
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futuredoc
PeaNut
PeaNut 576,169
January 2013
Posts: 173
Layouts: 0
Loc: where the wild things are
| Posted: 1/28/2013 1:48:18 PM
This is your family's life and your future. If he will not listen to you, then perhaps it's time to consider whether he should be a part of your future.
ETA: I looked up your previous threads. Your husband sounds like a jerk. I understand the owning your own business thing; my parents both had their own businesses for all/most of my life. And they both made mistakes and bad decisions at times, which impacted their financial status (and that of our family, when the kids were younger). BUT, never, ever, were we in a position where whether we would have electricity, water, food, a home, etc. was in question. | |
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mlana
StuckOnPeas
PeaNut 226,155
October 2005
Posts: 2,688
Layouts: 1
| Posted: 1/28/2013 2:22:33 PM
My dad is convinced that he was meant to be a small business owner and that his big success is just around the corner. For almost 30 years, he has refused to work for other people, saying he doesn't want to make someone else rich off of his sweat. He has absolutely no training in business and no business savvy whatsoever, and he refuses to listen to anyone who has either. For the last 20 years of his and Mom's marriage, he invested in one business after another, losing his shirt and digging them deeper into debt each time.
My mom worked one job after another to keep them afloat while he made plans. When she would try to discuss their situation with him, he would become angry and tell her that she needed to trust him, to have faith in him, to work thru the hard times because he knew what was best and was going to make all her work worthwhile. By the time Momma finally left him, he had reached the point where he wanted her to leave her job and follow him to FL where he was going to start a business working on small motors. Nevermind that they would be defaulting on a mortgage and tons of other debt, or that they didn't even have enough money for gas to FL, much less for a hotel or renting an apartment.
My mom did finally leave, for many reasons not all financial, and she ended up declaring bankruptcy. She has since found another job and lives with my grandmother who needed someone there in order to stay in her own home. Dad blames the end of his marriage on Mom's lack of faith in him. I will end up taking care of my mom when she is older, and my brother will take care of my dad.
I URGE you to get fierce about protecting your financial future. Don't let someone guilt you into turning over control of your future by telling you to have faith in them. Have faith, if you will, but make your own decisions. IF you know that things aren't adding up, find out where you stand and get good advice on what to do next. Listening to someone who has put you this far behind in your mortgage is not getting good advice.
Marcy |
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TravelAgent
Resident Smart Ass
PeaNut 294,429
January 2007
Posts: 12,673
Layouts: 7
Loc: Indiana
| Posted: 1/28/2013 3:21:46 PM
Work with the CPA to lower the hammer of reality right on his head.
It's exactly what my husband did when our retail store was sinking. As the one who was in there every day, I knew it was in trouble, but as its creator, I was also deluded by the common "tomorrow it could all turn around" thinking. His trying to get another business up and running (to save the first, I presume?) is yet another form of denial.
It's very difficult for a creator to say it didn't work. That's where all the "believe in me" language is coming from.
But financial realities don't work on the same track with dreams and hopes and intentions. They will run you right over and leave you stripped with nothing. Which was where my DH and the CPA ganged up on me with hard-core financial charts and ultimatums.
I will be grateful to them for their tough love forever. Because when the cloud of embarrassment and disappointment lifted, we weren't also bankrupt and hopeless for several decades from the mess. These two people saw to it that we cut our losses before they ate us alive.
I pray for that same scenario for you. Stay strong. He doesn't want to hear it, but he has to. Let the CPA do the talking, but remember that siding with the CPA is NOT "not believing in me, betraying me or stabbing me in the back." (Um, all words I may or may not have said in the heat of the moment.)
Julie |
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