Zimmerman Trial: Juror B 29 (minority juror) on ABC News tonight
Post ReplyPost New TopicPosted 7/25/2013 by back to *pea*ality in NSBR Board
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AncestralPea

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Posted: 7/25/2013 4:41:42 PM

"You can't put the man in jail even though in our hearts we felt he was guilty," said the woman who was identified only as Juror B29 during the trial. "But we had to grab our hearts and put it aside and look at the evidence."

She said the jury was following Florida law and the evidence, she said, did not prove murder.


Sorry, I can't get the link on this, reading on Facebook. I thought those that were interested in the trial might be interested.

Edited to add link-

Link

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AncestralPea

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Posted: 7/25/2013 4:48:20 PM
I also read this survey done by the Pew Research Center

Big Racial Divide over Zimmerman Verdict

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Posted: 7/25/2013 5:15:39 PM
Thanks for the link to the survey. I gotta say... I'm not at all surprised by the results. Going to watch the video now.

ETA: Reading comprehension is a good thing. I missed the part about the interview being tonight!


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Posted: 7/25/2013 5:16:14 PM
I'm not surprised by the results of the survey either.
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Posted: 7/25/2013 5:37:08 PM
While I do think race is a big part of this whole mess I believe that law is the real problem.

When you get past who did what to whom what you have is kid getting shot and the shooter not be held resposible for his actions.

I said on another thread I don't think GZ meant to shoot Trayvon but he set off a chain of events that led Trayon death and GZ is not being held responsible for it except by public opinion.

I wonder if that % of whites who are satisfied with the verdict would still feel that way if GZ shot a white kid? Especially since GZ is Hispanic. My guess is that % of whites who are satisfied with the verdict would be pretty low.

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Posted: 7/25/2013 6:19:47 PM
No, he killed Trayvon. But where he did it had a law that allowed him to do it if he said he felt threatened. He is guilty of killing him, but whether he was allowed to do it is the issue. He got away with it because of the law in Florida. In another state he might be wearing orange today.


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AncestralPea

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Posted: 7/25/2013 6:47:46 PM
With regard to the stand your ground law, I read that in 2004, then Senator Obama co-sponsored a bill to strengthen the existing stand your ground law in Illinois.


But the Illinois Review says Obama didn’t seem to have any of those concerns when in 2004 he co-sponsored S.B. 2386, which broadened the state’s Stand Your Ground law “by shielding the person who was attacked from being sued in civil court by perpetrators or their estates when a ’stand your ground’ defense is used in protecting his or her person, dwelling or other property.”

S.B. 2386 passed the Illinois state senate by a 56–0 vote on March 25, 2004. It sailed through the state house with only two “nay” votes. Both chambers were controlled by Democrats.




Obama voted to strengthen Illinois Stand Your Ground Law


Edited to ad Aslan has provided a link that disputes the presentation of this representation by national review.

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StuckOnPeas

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Posted: 7/25/2013 7:03:50 PM

Actually, he was tried for his actions and found not guilty.
You can't prove who threw the first punch.
There is no crime against calling the police and reporting a stranger in your own neighborhood. There is no crime in following someone in your neighborhood. There is no crime in legally carrying a concealed and loaded gun. There is no crime in firing that gun in legitimate self defense. There is no crime in asking someone what they are doing in your neighborhood. What crime is Zimmerman guilty of again?


If you honestly think that he is not guilty of anything then you are part of the problem and not part of the solution of what is wrong with this country when it comes to guns and race.


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AncestralPea

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Posted: 7/25/2013 7:08:38 PM
Aslan do you have a link? I'd like to read that too. Thx!

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Posted: 7/25/2013 7:09:02 PM

With regard to the stand your ground law, I read that in 2004, then Senator Obama co-sponsored a bill to strengthen the existing stand your ground law in Illinois.


So California has one as well. I suspect states that have them will take another look at it. On one level it makes sense but this one in Florida is flawed.

You know California has a stupid law called "three strikes". It was a mess. It took awhile but we are finally getting it straightened out.


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AncestralPea

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Posted: 7/25/2013 7:17:39 PM
I was listening to satellite radio and I cannot recall exactly the station/show but I believe I heard 32 states have some form of stand your ground laws.

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AncestralPea

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Posted: 7/25/2013 7:23:47 PM
Thanks Aslan. I understand the Castle doctrine and while I would support that, stand your ground is very different.

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Posted: 7/25/2013 8:13:28 PM

On one level it makes sense but this one in Florida is flawed.

Can you tell me what the flaw is in the Florida law?









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StuckOnPeas

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Posted: 7/25/2013 8:34:02 PM
Enough go read the article Scrappower just posted on the Interesting Questionnaire thread.

I especially agree with the comment toward the end that said "The law has more to do with the right to bear arms then Self defense"

scrappower
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Posted: 7/25/2013 10:34:02 PM
Yeah I posted the link in the wrong thread, meant to post it here.

Stats about Florida's SYG law that are troubling.

http://www.tampabay.com/news/courts/criminal/many-killers-who-go-free-with-florida-stand-your-ground-law-have-history/1241378



I-95
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Posted: 7/25/2013 10:49:22 PM

What difference does stand your ground make in this case? Absolutely none. The defense didn't rely on SYG. They tried this as a self defense case and there's a big difference.


Technically, that's true, but the jurors did consider SYG when making their decision...at least Juror B37 said she did. And SYG was the reason that Zimmerman was released the night of the killing, and not arrested for 46 days because the Chief of Police said it was SYG. So SYG is worth discussing... as it related to this case, and others in Florida.

I-95
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Posted: 7/25/2013 10:54:40 PM

The first juror to speak took it upon herself to speak for all, and then four other jurors had to issue a statement contradicting what she said. It just wasn't her place. It isn't this woman's place.


But wasn't this juror one of the 4 who contradicted Juror B37? Wouldn't that suggest she was speaking for herself, and 3 others? That's what I took it to mean, that they all felt pretty much the same way.We know at least 3 jurors, in the initial vote did not vote 'not guilty'. I presume 3 of the 4 were ones who signed the statement issued after B37 told the world she thought he was innocent right from the start.

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Posted: 7/25/2013 10:59:13 PM
I was responding to the question about how SYG in Florida is flawed, not saying it is related to the Zimmerman case.....although it is, see I-95's post.



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Posted: 7/25/2013 11:34:34 PM
I believe that I read that this woman is married to a lawyer and has already cut a book deal to write about her experience with the Z trial.




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Posted: 7/25/2013 11:47:35 PM
I find it hard to believe that anyone in America is okay with a grown man killing an unarmed teen. A teen on his way home at 7 o'clock at night. Sends a chill down my spine.


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Posted: 7/26/2013 1:43:45 AM
This juror was not one of the four who made a statement contradicting the original juror (B37?) who spoke out publicly the day after the trial.

Today's juror is the last one who hadn't said anything publicly yet.


I believe that I read that this woman is married to a lawyer and has already cut a book deal to write about her experience with the Z trial.

That was the original juror who spoke out -- B37. Not the one who was interviewed on ABC tonight.

B37's book deal has already been cancelled, too.


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AncestralPea

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Posted: 7/26/2013 5:54:06 AM
There is a lot of emotion about this case. No matter how you feel about GZ, I don't think anyone is "okay" with the death of a teenager or lacks compassion or feels empathy for the family.

Before this trial, I knew nothing about "stand your ground" laws. Now, I know we have a similar one in my state and that the majority of states have them in some form. Even though this law was not used as a defense in his trial, it gives gun owners the impression they can go to Target locked and loaded. I am not comfortable with that.




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AncestralPea

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Posted: 7/26/2013 6:00:25 AM
I have to say that I have a lot of respect for juror B29 who is showing her face during the interview. I think it takes a lot of courage to do this.

There was something about juror B 37's eagerness to cash in with a book deal that I found disturbing as well as many of her statements. I wonder if she was one of the females the prosecution moved to strike in voir dire.

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Posted: 7/26/2013 6:08:05 AM
Mrs Tyler.
And there's no crime in wearing a hoodie and getting some Skittles and and Arizona Tea and walking back to your apartment at night either. Baffles me when people don't seem to recognize that.

What crime was Trayvon Martin guilty of again? He's the child that's dead, you know.
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Posted: 7/26/2013 6:09:50 AM
I'm with Aslan with regard to jurors.



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Posted: 7/26/2013 7:13:54 AM

Seriously, Trollie, who is "okay" with it? I sure as heck am not. It's heartbreaking.


Sadly, a lot of people seem to be "okay" with this. Defending this. Championing this.


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Posted: 7/26/2013 7:22:31 AM
You don't need to school me on legal interpretation aslan. That's what my law professors and colleagues were/are for. That "it's not a crime" GZ rhetoric is the standard party line that those without much independent thought come up with. I've seen it a thousand times. I want *them* to know that TMs actions up to the confrontation were not a crime either.
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Posted: 7/26/2013 8:13:30 AM

I wonder if that % of whites who are satisfied with the verdict would still feel that way if GZ shot a white kid? Especially since GZ is Hispanic. My guess is that % of whites who are satisfied with the verdict would be pretty low.
I am neither satisfied nor dissatisfied with the verdict. For me, it is one of those issues that is best left to the jurors, the community and those involved to rectify. How can you possibly judge when you weren't there, you don't know any of the people involved, and all the information concerning the situation comes from a media that you don't trust?

FTR, had GZ shot a white kid, I highly doubt it would have gone any further than the local network news. Somehow I can't see Jackson stepping in on that one, or Obama for that matter.



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I-95
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Posted: 7/26/2013 9:01:10 AM

This juror was not one of the four who made a statement contradicting the original juror (B37?) who spoke out publicly the day after the trial.


Thanks Lucy. I wasn't paying a lot of attention to the news when they were discussing which of the jurors this one was. I heard them mention B37 and the 4 who signed the statement, I just made the leap that this one of the 4.

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Posted: 7/26/2013 9:56:53 AM

They tried this as a self defense case...


My problem with this is what about Trayvon feeling threatened and defending himself?



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I-95
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Posted: 7/26/2013 10:07:36 AM

She said that he was going to give GZ an ass whoopin' and that GZ should have taken it. GZ didn't have the benefit of knowing Trayvon's intentions. He just knew that punches were being thrown and he was scared and he shot Trayvon. And we will never know how far Trayvon intended to take it. But, my thoughts, for what it's worth are that he would have stopped short of killing GZ. He would have beat him up good to teach him a lesson, but not killed him. Only my speculation, though.


I have to wonder about this. I can see a 17yr old acting all tough when talking to a girl on the phone. GZ may have not known Trayvon's intentions, but nor did Trayvon know GZ's. For all we know GZ could have started the altercation... I simply don't find GZ's story about Trayvon saying 'what's your problem Homie?', believable. I believe Trayvon may have said 'What's your problem?' but I suspect GZ added the 'Homie' part to bolster his story, and because he thinks that's how young black thugs talk.

I also don't believe GZ's claim that Trayvon said 'You're gonna die tonight MFer'. This was a kid who admittedly had some problems at school, but he wasn't a thug, no matter how desperately some folks want to believe that. He came from a home where his mother was concerned enough, and proactive enough to send him up to his father when it appeared he was running with the wrong crowd and getting into trouble. He had parents who both held full time jobs. He had a father who was involved enough to accept the responsibility of being his father. Those are the actions of responsible parents. He had decent grades in school and was well liked by his teachers and peers. He was a kid who knew he was skating on thin ice, so it doesn't make sense, with his pretty stable upbringing, that he would be making statements like 'you're gonna die tonight MFer'. I think GZ embellished that too.

The final kicker in GZ's story of his interaction with Trayvon, was after he shot him, that Trayvon sat up and said 'You got me'....seriously? He had been shot through the heart and his lungs were filling up with blood...but he was able to talk? Not only talk, but sound like the dying character in a bad movie? I have serious doubts as to whether any of those verbal interchanges took place, in the way GZ claims they did.

Was GZ scared when he was on the ground? Probably. That would be normal...but was he 'really' so scared of being killed that his only option was to shoot Trayvon? Keeping in mind that GZ had been taking MMA classes 3X a week for a year, surely some of that training must have penetrated his brain, and taught him some self defense skills. He also knew he'd called the cops, and we know he'd had plenty of experience doing that, so he would know their response time was pretty quick. His injuries do not support his statements on Hannity that he was punched 'dozens of times' and lost count of the times his head was slammed into the concrete...yes, you can die from one hit, but it's exceedingly rare. I'm pretty sure most of us who have boys have seen our kids bleeding a lot worse, and injuries far more severe from playground/home accidents, than GZ had after his 'beating'.

I sincerely believe that if GZ had not had a gun, they would both be alive. I think folks who are saying 'well all he had to do was believe his life was in danger, and that makes the shooting justifiable' are setting the bar for self defense way too low. I'm sure it crosses the mind of anybody who's losing a fight that they 'might' die... so is everyone who's losing a fight, and claims they were afraid for their lives, get to kill the person who is beating on them? No matter who started it? Because that's what I'm hearing a lot of you, and the State of Florida, say. And THAT concerns me.

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Posted: 7/26/2013 10:55:36 AM

If you and others are concerned about the message that is sent by this not guilty verdict- that anyone can shoot anyone and claim self defense and get away with it, have you stopped to think what would be the effect of GZ being convicted, despite his adherence to the existing laws, and people henceforth assuming that any time they feel scared they get to come out swinging?


What about GZ being responsible for starting the chain of events that led Trayvon Martin's death?

It seems that people keep sweeping that under the rug as it doesn't matter. It should matter.

Once he reported Trayvon to the police he didn't have to follow him. But he did. And by doing so set off the chain of events that let to Trayvon's death. Why shouldn't he be held accountable.

How can he claim self defense when he was the aggressor. The fact that he started to fear for his life, well who put themself in the postion in the first place.

It wasn't like he was just walking down the street and Trayvon didn't like the way he looked and started pounding on him.

No no GZ deliberately put himself in the situation and couldn't handle it so killed the kid. And got off scott free for it. That is the message that is being sent.




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AncestralPea

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Posted: 7/26/2013 12:22:05 PM

While I do think race is a big part of this whole mess I believe that law is the real problem.

When you get past who did what to whom what you have is kid getting shot and the shooter not be held resposible for his actions.

I said on another thread I don't think GZ meant to shoot Trayvon but he set off a chain of events that led Trayon death and GZ is not being held responsible for it except by public opinion.


Perfectly stated


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Posted: 7/26/2013 12:32:23 PM
I agree with every word of I-95's long post above.


He was shot because he was on top of George Zimmerman throwing punches and in that moment George Zimmerman feared for his life.

That is not an established fact. That is George Zimmerman's story, and to me, much of his story is not very credible.

So it's kind of meaningless to me when you use it as "evidence" of what happened that night.


FTR, had GZ shot a white kid, I highly doubt it would have gone any further than the local network news. Somehow I can't see Jackson stepping in on that one, or Obama for that matter.

I agree that if George Zimmerman had shot a white kid, it would not have turned into a national news story.

But that's because I believe George Zimmerman would have been promptly arrested for murder if it had been a white kid.


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Posted: 7/26/2013 1:57:49 PM

I agree that if George Zimmerman had shot a white kid, it would not have turned into a national news story.

But that's because I believe George Zimmerman would have been promptly arrested for murder if it had been a white kid.


Fucking-A he would have and I'd love to see his defenders, defend THAT.

Oh wait....I'm sorry, he wouldn't have had any defenders.





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Posted: 7/26/2013 2:20:41 PM

And SYG was the reason that Zimmerman was released the night of the killing, and not arrested for 46 days because the Chief of Police said it was SYG

That was the reasoning behind him NOT being arrested - but he was arrested, and tried.
Didn't 2 prosecutors refuse to charge GZ? And the one who did now has a lawsuit against her?


What crime was Trayvon Martin guilty of again? He's the child that's dead, you know.

attacking GZ. TM wasn''t a small, weak child either.


I want *them* to know that TMs actions up to the confrontation were not a crime either.

but his attack on GZ was.


And we will never know how far Trayvon intended to take it. But, my thoughts, for what it's worth are that he would have stopped short of killing GZ. He would have beat him up good to teach him a lesson, but not killed him

how would TM know which blow was the one 'short of killing' GZ?
What right did he have to teach GZ 'a lesson'?
Then do you also support parents who beat their kids (just short of killing them) to teach them a lesson?


so it doesn't make sense, with his pretty stable upbringing, that he would be making statements like 'you're gonna die tonight MFer'.

You have no idea if TM had a 'pretty stable upbringing'. Even IF he did, how does that stop him from saying 'you're gonna die tonight etc' ?

TM was no longer the 12 yr old (approx) kid shown in pics on tv news since this happened. Nor was he smaller than GZ.


I'm pretty sure most of us who have boys have seen our kids bleeding a lot worse, and injuries far more severe from playground/home accidents, than GZ had after his 'beating'.

I raised 3 boys and yes, several accidents that caused more bleeding. None were from being attacked by someone else tho, just boy/kid things.





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Posted: 7/26/2013 3:03:50 PM

I simply don't find GZ's story about Trayvon saying 'what's your problem Homie?', believable.
It's still being used in music today, and people are still using it.


but I suspect GZ added the 'Homie' part to bolster his story, and because he thinks that's how young black thugs talk.
Since people are still using the word, your logic doesn't hold up.


This was a kid who admittedly had some problems at school, but he wasn't a thug, no matter how desperately some folks want to believe that.
His own friend believed it and said so in texts to him and warned him that with his actions he was going to get a bullet planted in his chest.


He was a kid who knew he was skating on thin ice, so it doesn't make sense, with his pretty stable upbringing, that he would be making statements like 'you're gonna die tonight MFer'. I think GZ embellished that too.
Millions of kids that come from stable families do and say things away from their parents and teachers, that they wouldn't do in front of their parents and teachers. It's always been that way and it always will be that way. He could have been trash talking to psyche out his opponent. But Zimmerman didn't know that. So your logic doesn't hold up here either.




The final kicker in GZ's story of his interaction with Trayvon, was after he shot him, that Trayvon sat up and said 'You got me'....seriously? He had been shot through the heart and his lungs were filling up with blood...but he was able to talk?
I believe it was the medical examiner that explained, under oath, how this is possible. Again, mistaken logic on your part.


Not only talk, but sound like the dying character in a bad movie? I have serious doubts as to whether any of those verbal interchanges took place, in the way GZ claims they did.
When you're in shock and dying, you're going to go with the most basic of terms when you speak. The fact that bad movies have use this basic principle in their scripts has no bearing on the facts of this case.


That would be normal...but was he 'really' so scared of being killed that his only option was to shoot Trayvon? Keeping in mind that GZ had been taking MMA classes 3X a week for a year, surely some of that training must have penetrated his brain, and taught him some self defense skills.
In a fight, even with the most trained fighters, somebody wins and somebody loses. Zimmerman was apparently losing. And probably panicked.


He also knew he'd called the cops, and we know he'd had plenty of experience doing that, so he would know their response time was pretty quick.
When you're in what you perceive as a fight for your life and panicked, and you see him reaching for your gun and saying those words, you come to the conclusion, you're out of time. Even you would.


His injuries do not support his statements on Hannity that he was punched 'dozens of times' and lost count of the times his head was slammed into the concrete...yes, you can die from one hit, but it's exceedingly rare.
You can dissect the injuries to fit you narrative till the cows come home. The fact is he had injuries and they do support his statement. Whether you like it or not. There is also a witness that supports the very statement that you claim couldn't possibly be true.







Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. MLK JR

PeaCeaRyder
BucketHead

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Posted: 7/26/2013 9:50:29 PM


FTR, had GZ shot a white kid, I highly doubt it would have gone any further than the local network news. Somehow I can't see Jackson stepping in on that one, or Obama for that matter.
I agree that if George Zimmerman had shot a white kid, it would not have turned into a national news story.

But that's because I believe George Zimmerman would have been promptly arrested for murder if it had been a white kid.
Sadly, you are probably right about that.



"It is the duty of nations as well as of men to own their dependence upon the overruling power of God...and to recognize the sublime truth, announced in the Holy Scriptures and proven by all history, that those nations only are blessed whose God is the Lord." - Abraham Lincoln

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lynlam
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Posted: 7/26/2013 10:23:07 PM
ABC heavily edited the interview. Very heavily. The truth is quite different from what actually aired. Do some research.





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Lynlam, the second-tier Pea, paid (except it appears she is not) political shill.
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I-95
It's all just nonsense anyway!

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Posted: 7/27/2013 12:20:29 AM

You have no idea if TM had a 'pretty stable upbringing'. Even IF he did, how does that stop him from saying 'you're gonna die tonight etc' ?


Actually, I do. I know both his parents hold full time jobs. His mother is a college graduate, and his older brother is a senior at Florida State. I know his mother was concerned about the trouble he was getting into at school. I know he had pretty decent grades, and from comments by teachers and peers, he was a well liked kid...albeit one that might have been starting to go down the wrong path in life....but his mother stepped in a sent up to his dad, who accepted the responsibility. He didn't say 'no, you deal with it', he wasn't a deadbeat dad. I've seen his parents on TV and they are well spoken, middle class people...much like the rest of us.

I've known a number of young men Trayvon's age who were good kids, from good homes, who went off the rails during their teen years, and straightened out again by the time they were 20 or so. No matter how much pot you smoke, or bragging you do about what a tough a guy you are, all the indications point to the fact that Trayvon Martin came from a family who did raise him right. Generally speaking a normally decent kid, on his way back from 7-11, doesn't suddenly decide that this is the night he's going to murder someone. Could it happen? Anything is possible, but given his whole life background, it's unlikely.

scrappower
Allons-y Alonso

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Posted: 7/27/2013 8:35:13 AM
What I find interesting is that some choose to take Zimmerman's word as complete and utter truth, but tell the rest of us we have no idea and are just guessing about Trayvon. Just because GZ says it went down one way does not make it completely truthful. He of course is out to paint himself in the best light possible. Just something I have been noticing as people are throwing around that TM absolutely said "you are gonna die", etc. You simply don't know that.



TeachOne
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Posted: 7/27/2013 10:16:22 AM
" She said that he was going to give GZ an ass whoopin' and that GZ should have taken it"

Aslan- This was NOT evidence in the trial. Rachel DID NOT hear Trayvon uttering those words. This was HER interpretation of what she believed may have happened that night based on a question during a television interview. She said "In my neighborhood we call that an ass whooping and GZ should have taken it".

Can we please refrain from attributing things to Trayvon that he did not say or do. Under oath, she said that if Trayvon were going to start a fight he would have gotten off the phone with her first. She was talking to him when the phone suddenly went dead. I think it is funny how no one believed her in court but everyone wants to take her words in these after trial interviews as golden. All she is doing now is speculating. She needs to get out of the limelight.
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Enough
PeaAddict

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Posted: 7/27/2013 2:26:11 PM

What I find interesting is that some choose to take Zimmerman's word as complete and utter truth, but tell the rest of us we have no idea and are just guessing about Trayvon. Just something I have been noticing
Scrappower, no one takes it as complete and utter truth. There's no possible way to know that and EVERYBODY understands that. But what you failed to notice is that the people you're noticing understand that George's words may be true or lies, but they are something more tangible to go on than someone who wasn't even there's feelings and beliefs and outright dismissal of facts. That's what you are misunderstanding.



Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. MLK JR

scrappower
Allons-y Alonso

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Posted: 7/27/2013 3:16:22 PM

Scrappower, no one takes it as complete and utter truth. There's no possible way to know that and EVERYBODY understands that. But what you failed to notice is that the people you're noticing understand that George's words may be true or lies, but they are something more tangible to go on than someone who wasn't even there's feelings and beliefs and outright dismissal of facts. That's what you are misunderstanding.


I disagree.



lucyg819
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Posted: 7/27/2013 4:49:38 PM

He of course is out to paint himself in the best light possible.

But, in fairness, who in that situation would be out to paint themselves in the worst way possible??

Well, of course. That's why I take any defendant's statements with a grain of salt. You didn't like it when I said that the first time.


LUCYG
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"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts."
--Bertrand Russell



Krazyscrapper
StuckOnPeas

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Posted: 7/27/2013 5:32:17 PM

but they are something more tangible to go on than someone who wasn't even there's feelings and beliefs and outright dismissal of facts.



"Dismissal of facts." That is the problem. There are no facts other than GZ story. The only fact is there is no proof that GZ's story is what really happened. It has nothing to do with feelings and beliefs but the FACT there is no one to collaborate GZ's story. Who killed someone. That he was following.

Enough
PeaAddict

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Posted: 7/27/2013 5:43:57 PM

"Dismissal of facts." That is the problem. There are no facts other than GZ story.
If you really truly believe that, then you haven't been paying attention.








Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. MLK JR

~*Trollie*~
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Posted: 7/27/2013 6:37:38 PM
Fact: Trayvon is dead because Zimmerman shot him with his (Zimmerman's) concealed weapon, after being pursued on foot by Zimmerman for walking home at 7 at night with a hoodie on, even after the 911 operator told him he didn't need to do that. Fact: Trayvon was armed with iced tea and skittles.


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PeaWee

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Posted: 7/27/2013 8:21:27 PM
I just finished an article on race and crime and thought some might find this interesting. According to the New Century Foundation, an organization that studies the affect of immigration and/or race on various issues, it is 50% more common for a black person to shoot and kill a white person than vice-versa. Other sources indicate that the 50% is a conservative figure. Almost every person I interviewed for this article wondered why there isn't more outrage over the increasing black-on-white violence in this country.

Another issue that was brought up by those I interviewed was that Z was consistently accused of being a racist and while that may be true, so was Martin.

One last point people have raised is that race of biracial individuals is obviously skewed by both sides both in this case and in others. Interesting point I hope to pursue in regard to other cases as well.

Krazyscrapper
StuckOnPeas

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Posted: 7/27/2013 8:27:02 PM

krazy, did you watch the trial? Any of it? I don't know how you can say that there are no facts other than GZ's story.
There was testimony at the trial from both sides that dealt with the FACTS of the case.



I believe your definition of facts is getting confused with opinions from "experts" and witnesses that only saw part of what happened.

We still don't know who was yelling help. For all we know both of them were yelling help at different times or at the same time. And that is entirely plausible.

One witness puts GZ on top and one on the bottom. Ok in a fight on the the ground that happens.

GZ feared for his life because TM was banging his head against the sidewalk. However the medical folks said he didn't really have the symptoms for serious head banging. Just a couple of bumps. So what does that make GZ a wimp or someone who exaggerate the situation to help make his case for killing TM?

Oh wait you have the guy from the gym. GZ is taking MMA training but he is not in good shape. In his opinion. I'm sure someone could find another witness that based on his opinion GZ was in great shape.

Where is the smoking gun? Where is the witness that saw what happened from beginning to the end? Without that witness the rest of the stuff was just window dressing. It all goes back to GZ's story on what happened and there is no one to collaborate his story.













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