Info please - Re: Secession Petitions filed in 20 states

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Posted 11/12/2012 by xicanabuela in NSBR Board
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xicanabuela
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Posted: 11/12/2012 3:36:41 PM
Is your state one that has citizens who have signed a petition to secede from the United States? Is this a viable idea? Please enlighten me. Any comments?
I would make a comment, but in my head it sounds too crazy, so I will wait and try to calm myself, until I can become rational.
Note: I read a report about this on Yahoo news (i.e., I don't know the reliability of the source).

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Posted: 11/12/2012 3:38:54 PM
My state was on the list along with NJ, both of which are blue states! I always joke that it would be kinda awesome if they both seceded and formed their own country. Between NJ factories and NY's farmland I think we'd be just fine on our own.




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aprilfay21
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Posted: 11/12/2012 3:40:30 PM
I haven't read enough to form a solid opinion but I'm not surprised that Texas has the most signatures. As far as I'm aware, it's wanted to secede practically since it became a state.




This is Texas. We don't have regular seasons here. We have Summer 1, Summer 2, Summer 3 and January.

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Posted: 11/12/2012 3:41:47 PM

Is your state one that has citizens who have signed a petition to secede from the United States? Is this a viable idea?
This, IMO, is ridiculous on the same level of stockpiling. I can't believe anyone would think it's viable or admit to signing such a document.

mtomseth
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Posted: 11/12/2012 3:50:27 PM
I think people are having irrational and emotional responses to losing an election and seriously doubt they have thought the subject through.

They want to seceed, and then what?? Have their own currency? Close off the borders?? Negotiate trade agreements with all 50 states? How will they tranpsort their goods/services?? Will they require a passport for people who want to leave and/or enter?

revirdsuba
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Posted: 11/12/2012 3:51:07 PM
(Shhhhh........) NY and NJ are getting a lot of federal $$$ right now... Although, if we were our own country, we would have all the tax dollars that go to the feds. We could keep it here in 'our' country.

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Posted: 11/12/2012 3:51:18 PM
Is your state one that has citizens who have signed a petition to secede from the United States? Is this a viable idea?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This, IMO, is ridiculous on the same level of stockpiling. I can't believe anyone would think it's viable or admit to signing such a document.


====================================================

I agree. And if I remember my civics classes correctly, is it not impossible to secede from the union? You know--UNITED States and all that. It seems I remember something about no state or part of a state may secede....



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Posted: 11/12/2012 3:51:26 PM
I love the idea. If those states go, more federal money for my state. Then I imagine a world with strict border patrol where you are only allowed to leave with a visa that would be very hard to come by- and costly. No federal road monies would mean higher taxes right? And what if the US had a trade embargo against you and you had no fuel, electricity, food, anything. Sure, the first few years would be rough and I'm sure they'd figure it out. So go for it! Who exactly would be the immigrants to complain about in those situations? So many questions...

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Posted: 11/12/2012 3:56:18 PM
Separationitis is spreading? Shame. My thoughts on States wanting to secede is the same opinion that I have about Quebec's constant whining about separating... and it's not a pretty opinion.

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Posted: 11/12/2012 3:57:22 PM
Oh, I'm sure my state (TN) has people wanting to do it. I think Tennessee is one of the birth places of the Tea Party movement, so I doubt we're skipping the whole secession thing. Shouldn't we have our own Army first, though? Obviously we can save money and skip the Navy part. I think we would also need a big old complicated border patrol system. And then we would have to make some new roads because I think the interstates are federally owned, right?


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Posted: 11/12/2012 4:09:41 PM
Texas has almost 29k signatures now.




This is Texas. We don't have regular seasons here. We have Summer 1, Summer 2, Summer 3 and January.

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Posted: 11/12/2012 4:10:48 PM
Texas probably had those same 29K signatures already. This is not a new movement for Texas.


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Posted: 11/12/2012 4:30:57 PM
Peter Griffin tried it on Family Guy, and it didn't work:

E. Peterbus Unum (Petoria)

(although I'm surprised AZ isn't on that list; I think there's some crackpot who brings up this type of legislation fairly regularly here...)



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Posted: 11/12/2012 4:33:49 PM
I don't know about seceedeing from the US but I know a whole lot of up-state NYers that wish NYC would seceede from the state.





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Posted: 11/12/2012 4:34:42 PM

Texas probably had those same 29K signatures already. This is not a new movement for Texas.
The petition I saw that I was referring to was originated on November 9, 2012. The signatures don't carry over.




This is Texas. We don't have regular seasons here. We have Summer 1, Summer 2, Summer 3 and January.

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Posted: 11/12/2012 4:42:45 PM
Yah I am pretty sure florida is one of those states. It is a ridiculous notion and will never happen. Sour grapes.



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Posted: 11/12/2012 4:43:40 PM
I'm not surprised that Texas is on the list.

I had this conversation with a friend of mine who is a good-ole-boy. He's the type who loves guns and has a crazy uncle with a bunker out in the desert full of weapons.

He actually believes that those left in Texas after it secedes will be able to put up a fight against the U.S. military. And he's in the military and knows what we can do!

He's a good friend. I love him to death and told him that when the crap hits the fan, I'll find a way to sneak him out. LOL




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Posted: 11/12/2012 4:43:48 PM
Seriously?



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Posted: 11/12/2012 4:48:09 PM
Since I had to sit in gas lines and had no power I lost touch with the world...what's this? NJ wants to secede? Why? Because of the election?

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Posted: 11/12/2012 5:00:18 PM
The whole thing makes me laugh. I'd love to read the plans these groups have to make their states succession go smoothly. It's has to read like a comedy.


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Posted: 11/12/2012 5:02:56 PM
I think its silly, too, and more of a symbolic gesture.

Not too long ago a representative in Illinois filed a petition for everything in Illinois south of Chicago to secede from the state.

I watched an interview with him and he said he knew it would never go anywhere but he did it as a gesture to let the state government know how upset downstaters are with the representation in our state.



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Posted: 11/12/2012 5:03:45 PM
My state is on the list. It's been all over our local news.

http://whnt.com/2012/11/12/alabama-among-states-petitioning-the-u-s-government-to-secede-from-the-country/


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Posted: 11/12/2012 5:03:59 PM
"New Jersey" doesn't want to secede - nor do the other states. No one has called a state convention to vote on this. It's random people on a website, engaging in that lazy sport, Internet Activism. At least, that's all I can tell from the website.


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Posted: 11/12/2012 5:06:30 PM
I saw that earlier. Here is an idea. Everyone that wants to secede from the US, should just pack up and go. Maybe they can find an island somewhere and set up their own country. For the few that want to secede from the US, there are many, many more in those states that prefer to be exactly where we are as American citizens. There is all kinds of crazy out there. Oh yeah, one more thing, when they leave, they should be required to take FOX News, Glen Beck, and RL with them.




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Posted: 11/12/2012 5:08:09 PM
Shoot - I kept reading.

The NY petition has 6,000 signatures so far. There are 3,000 people in the high school I work at.

Bunches of the signatories are not even from New York.

Tempest not even in a teapot. Shame on Yahoo. This is sensationalist nonsense, imo.


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Posted: 11/12/2012 5:08:36 PM
I guess I think... since no state will actually secede but the petition signers feel so strongly about it, they should just go ahead and renounce their citizenship and form their own little union somewhere else. There's enough of them to make a little republic somewhere. They just shouldn't be able use any federally funded infrastructure on the way to where ever it is they are going nor any US currency. They can go via canoe in the rivers or hoof it through the woods and fields. Have at it, start over and make a go of it.



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Posted: 11/12/2012 5:09:29 PM

I know a whole lot of up-state NYers that wish NYC would seceede from the state.


Oh, I totally agree with you, Lauren. In a way this is a microcosm of what is happening to the country as a whole. Upstate New Yorkers would vote overwhelmingly to secede from NYC. The rest of the state sends horrifying amounts of money, etc. etc. to the City. I read somewhere how much my little county has to send EVERY single month to NYC to support welfare--and that is exactly what it is. The check is for welfare payments only! If the rest of us could just keep what we send to the City, we would be doing just fine indeed. But we can never vote it in--they outnumber us.


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Posted: 11/12/2012 5:25:14 PM

I saw that earlier. Here is an idea. Everyone that wants to secede from the US, should just pack up and go. Maybe they can find an island somewhere and set up their own country. For the few that want to secede from the US, there are many, many more in those states that prefer to be exactly where we are as American citizens. There is all kinds of crazy out there. Oh yeah, one more thing, when they leave, they should be required to take FOX News, Glen Beck, and RL with them.

AMEN!
I don't even have to look to know TN is probably on that list too! What a bunch of crap. I say let them go to Mexico, and they can all live happily ever after, with the gun cartels, drugs, and professional kidnappers..

I heard today on the radio that Haslam of TN has said he will not honor healthcare regulations, I say if he won't kick him out, or take away his healthcare.


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Posted: 11/12/2012 5:29:22 PM
I think there are many of us in Eastern Washington who might do the same thing with the Seattle area. The huge population there wins every vote, but the things they vote on and we get taxed for have little or no benefit for this side of the state!


Oh, I totally agree with you, Lauren. In a way this is a microcosm of what is happening to the country as a whole. Upstate New Yorkers would vote overwhelmingly to secede from NYC. The rest of the state sends horrifying amounts of money, etc. etc. to the City. I read somewhere how much my little county has to send EVERY single month to NYC to support welfare--and that is exactly what it is. The check is for welfare payments only! If the rest of us could just keep what we send to the City, we would be doing just fine indeed. But we can never vote it in--they outnumber us.

e_doe
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Posted: 11/12/2012 5:42:33 PM
I've been saying this ever since I learned Texas was "threatening" to secede: you go. We keep the land. Good luck homesteading out in the Gulf.

It's ridiculous. The only time this was tried was a little something we called The Civil War. Lincoln had the foresight to see that letting those states secede was a bad idea (think Europe in the Napoleonic era). He was a brilliant man for reasons people often disregard today.
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Posted: 11/12/2012 5:42:34 PM

I think there are many of us in Eastern Washington who might do the same thing with the Seattle area. The huge population there wins every vote, but the things they vote on and we get taxed for have little or no benefit for this side of the state!


The Seattle area contributes more in taxes than it receives.

sues
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Posted: 11/12/2012 5:44:39 PM

Not too long ago a representative in Illinois filed a petition for everything in Illinois south of Chicago to secede from the state.

I watched an interview with him and he said he knew it would never go anywhere but he did it as a gesture to let the state government know how upset downstaters are with the representation in our state.


Shame on him for wasting time on something so nonsensical, then. Like the state doesn't have enough problems he could be working on.

I get the whole matter of discontent with a big city that monopolizes resources and/or representation. But for pete's sake... if you aren't going to actually work on something real- pass the job on to someone else. Secession.....jeez louise!

ArlaMo
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Posted: 11/12/2012 6:23:36 PM

The Seattle area contributes more in taxes than it receives.


Not from all the reading I've done. But, I do admit that I read things written on this side of the state (east.) Even if it is the case, decisions are voted in by Seattle area people that just don't jive with or benefit the rest of the state.

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Posted: 11/12/2012 6:30:55 PM
At one time Vancouver tried to succeed from Washington state and join Oregon. It didn't pass and was never (that I'm aware of) put on the ballot again.

ashwyness
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Posted: 11/12/2012 6:58:53 PM
http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/petition/secede.asp


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Posted: 11/12/2012 7:40:23 PM
I think a lot of this is extreme discouragement & sadness about where our country is headed.

I feel it, & most of my IRL friends do too. It is what it is. The left can say "You need to just get over it," but it's not that easy.

No, I have not signed the petitions going around, and don't plan to sign. However, it's going to take awhile for my political mood to come out of the doldrums, and I'm not ashamed of acknowledging that fact.

Mocking us for being upset does nothing to ease the divide between us; it only strengthens it. Personally, I know that it upsets my liberal friends to say negative things about the President & his family that aren't policy related, and I never have. I didn't post ugly things on FB about, not so much out of respect for the President, but out of respect for my friends & fellow Americans who love him.
I can't do anything about what the rest of my fellow conservatives do, but I can for me.

Give us a little time. I'm not going to pretend I'm not sad, but I'm not going to be sad forever.


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Posted: 11/12/2012 7:48:41 PM
As a Canadian I don't understand if this will work to get them out of the US but I think it will definitely get them on the Ridiculist!

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Posted: 11/12/2012 7:51:26 PM

I think there are many of us in Eastern Washington who might do the same thing with the Seattle area. The huge population there wins every vote, but the things they vote on and we get taxed for have little or no benefit for this side of the state!
For the most part, when Denver votes on taxes for certain things it affects the Denver metro area only. I appreciate that.


As for the people who signed? Buh-bye. Seriously you want to be your own country, then get the hell our of ours.


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Posted: 11/12/2012 7:54:33 PM

Mocking us for being upset does nothing to ease the divide between us; it only strengthens it.
This is not a matter of being upset. There is a wide gap between "upset" and renouncing your nation. I don't think anyone can expect not to get some push-back for that. Joshing about it is probably the kindest thing we can do.


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Posted: 11/12/2012 8:26:37 PM
Whatever. Liberals say conservatives don't get it, but y'all don't get it either. These people are seriously depressed & upset and are acting out of that depression.

This president is making huge, permanent changes to the US. It's not easy for those of us who disagree with it to watch. This is a manifestation of that.


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Posted: 11/12/2012 8:28:43 PM

This president is making huge, permanent changes to the US.


What ARE the 'huge, permanent changes' that everyone is do upset about?


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Posted: 11/12/2012 8:34:29 PM
How about trying to get rid of our bombs, or cutting from our military or how about the fact he is in bed with the enemy & claiming he can do whatever he wants his last 4 years! Glad to know I'm not the only one that wanted it
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Posted: 11/12/2012 8:35:32 PM



The whole thing makes me laugh. I'd love to read the plans these groups have to make their states succession go smoothly. It's has to read like a comedy.


Indeed.


Well Peas, I believe this thread has gone Thrusday.
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Posted: 11/12/2012 8:35:58 PM
Let it be known, that I hereby am just going to follow Sues around and say, "What she said."

That is all.


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Posted: 11/12/2012 8:37:10 PM
Jody, I don't know if this will make you feel better but it's a different perspective from a conservative.

Conservatives, don't despair


Compare the United States of 2012 to the United States of 1962. Leave aside the obvious points about segregation and discrimination, and look only at the economy.
In 1962, the government regulated the price and route of every airplane, every freight train, every truck and every merchant ship in the United States. The government regulated the price of natural gas. It regulated the interest on every checking account and the commission on every purchase or sale of stock. Owning a gold bar was a serious crime that could be prosecuted under the Trading with the Enemy Act. The top rate of income tax was 91%.
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It was illegal to own a telephone. Phones had to be rented from the giant government-regulated monopoly that controlled all telecommunications in the United States. All young men were subject to the military draft and could escape only if they entered a government-approved graduate course of study. The great concern of students of American society -- of liberals such as David Riesman, of conservatives such as Russell Kirk, and of radicals such as Dwight Macdonald -- was the country's stultifying, crushing conformity.
Even if you look only at the experiences of white heterosexual men, the United States of 2012 is a freer country in almost every way than the United States of 1962.


ETA: As far as this:

How about trying to get rid of our bombs, or cutting from our military or how about the fact he is in bed with the enemy & claiming he can do whatever he wants his last 4 years! Glad to know I'm not the only one that wanted it


Link us up and prove those big claims you are making.



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Posted: 11/12/2012 8:43:06 PM

What are the 'huge, permanent changes' ?


Well, for starters, Obamacare. Not only does it drastically change our medical system, but it also has huge affects on our deficit and many other things, some of which scare the ever-lovin' crap out of me. <--- (end of life care issues)

It's the biggest change in our way of living I have seen in my lifetime, and I am 42.


**Jody**

"The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government -- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests."
Patrick Henry

jodster70
To the right, To the right

PeaNut 51,257
October 2002
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Posted: 11/12/2012 8:45:24 PM
Thanks Sarah. Those are really good points, and ones I hadn't seen before!



**Jody**

"The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government -- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests."
Patrick Henry

Sierramoon
PeaFixture

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Posted: 11/12/2012 9:10:57 PM

I agree. The mocking attitude of the "winners" is not unexpected, but is part of the reason people are panicking and going to this kind of extreme desire, impractical as it may be. Instead of a wake-up call that fellow citizens are hurting and upset, instead of a desire to open a dialogue that will help heal the divisiveness created by the nastiness of the election and the preceding years, it's yet another reason to point and laugh and do the "we won, get over it" dance.


That's interesting. After the election results were announced, my facebook wall was full of my 'friends' calling me (as a liberal) an idiot and claiming that those who vote for Obama are on welfare, lazy, stupid and only want free things from the government.

And don't get me started on the attitude of the right after the 2010 mid term elections. The crowing about the 'mandate' that was supposedly set was enough to set my teeth on edge.

I'm not going to actively console a group of people who call me names and imply that I'm lazy and without a job, but I will refrain from gloating about the election win. My facebook posts have been about everything but the election.




*~*"Life's candy and the sun's a ball of butter..."*~*



TXDancermom
AncestralPea

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Posted: 11/12/2012 9:23:45 PM
our governor regularly advocates for it....I am not for it, the state government would not be able to pick up services that the federal government supplies without increasing our tax burden. And, if it did happen, I think dh and I would seriously consider moving.

in theory it may sound good, but the practical matters would be a mess.

jmho

homespunhurricaine
PeaNut

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Posted: 11/12/2012 9:32:16 PM

ETA: As far as this:

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How about trying to get rid of our bombs, or cutting from our military or how about the fact he is in bed with the enemy & claiming he can do whatever he wants his last 4 years! Glad to know I'm not the only one that wanted it
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Link us up and prove those big claims you are making.


Im not sure where you would like me to link on the nukes from a liberal site or other thats common knowledge that he is cutting ours 80% or more & yes this scares the hell out of me bc noone else is doing so...is he trying to set us up for failure? after hearing this clip i think so, why else would he say something like this?http://articles.businessinsider.com/2012-03-27/politics/31242812_1_russian-president-president-obama-president-medvedev what more do you need? oh and thanks for speaking on obamacare bc thats pretty scary too! Lets see where yall sit in about 6 months when it comes to rooting for Obama
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