Question about that Carnival cruise ship....does anyone know why they didn't send other boats
Post ReplyPost New TopicPosted 2/14/2013 by cdnstorelady in NSBR Board
 

cdnstorelady
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Posted: 2/14/2013 4:28:40 PM
Out there to take the passengers off...I realize there are several thousand but it's not like they were a day or so from shore. Couldn't they have taken them back, or towed the ship back to Cozumel? The map in the newspaper makes it look like they broken down much closer to Mexico than the u.s.

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Posted: 2/14/2013 4:32:54 PM
I've wondered about that too. Get those poor people off that stinking thing! They are HOURS out from Mobile, but they will be able to see land and know they have a long wait to get off that boat. It must be horrible to be trapped like that.

sues
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Posted: 2/14/2013 4:36:07 PM
This morning I heard something about people having to go through a medical kind of 'check up' when they get off the boat. Surely this will be voluntary, right? Or is someone confused about the triage area for those in need?

I also heard that they have to board a bus after that to be taken to a hotel. It sounded like an hour away. Why?

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Posted: 2/14/2013 4:38:32 PM
The water is too choppy to transfer to other boats.
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Posted: 2/14/2013 4:39:41 PM
I was wondering that myself. The only thing I could figure is they didn't have a spare cruise ship available that could hold all those people.




Annabella
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Posted: 2/14/2013 4:41:32 PM
They said going back to America would be better since not everyone has passports.




Loydene
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Posted: 2/14/2013 4:48:06 PM
There really aren't any cruise ships just sitting around -- it isn't like a used car lot!

sues
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Posted: 2/14/2013 4:50:23 PM
She didn't ask why another cruise ship didn't come to their aid. She asked why other boats didn't come to offload passengers.

cdnstorelady
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Posted: 2/14/2013 4:50:40 PM
I understand there aren't empty cruise ships sitting around but since they want to get the, to land as asap, they wouldn't need a luxry boat which sails aling at a leisurely pace......

basketdiva
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Posted: 2/14/2013 4:53:19 PM
I live on the eastern shore of Mobile Bay. The hotels are not an hour away from the dock. More like 15-20 minutes.

Here is what has been said:

Carnival said it will have medical staff available at Mobile’s docks to handle any health issues disembarking passengers may have.

But the weary won’t be able to rest too long. Buses will be waiting to transport passengers from Mobile to Galveston or Houston, Carnival said. That’s about a seven-hour drive.
Passengers can also take a two-hour bus ride to New Orleans, where the company said it booked 1,500 hotel rooms.

Those staying in New Orleans will be flown Friday to Houston. Carnival said it will cover all the transportation costs.

sues
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Posted: 2/14/2013 4:55:53 PM

But the weary won’t be able to rest too long. Buses will be waiting to transport passengers from Mobile to Galveston or Houston, Carnival said. That’s about a seven-hour drive.
Passengers can also take a two-hour bus ride to New Orleans, where the company said it booked 1,500 hotel rooms.

Right. This is along the lines of what I remember. My question is- why take them so far? Why not get them into a hotel room immediately- let them shower and have a decent meal and a good night's sleep before slamming them onto a bus for hours?

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Posted: 2/14/2013 4:58:30 PM
From what I understand, transferring 4000 people (3000 guests and 1000 crew) would be really dangerous. You'd have to pull another boat up and then transfer everyone. Could you imagine what would happen if anyone fell off or got hurt in the process? 3000 people are a LOT of people.



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Posted: 2/14/2013 5:11:47 PM
I've been asking my dh the same thing! They could have either sent some other boats or even several big helicopters (like the ones the Navy/Army use) out to get these people off. They should have at least found a way to get the passengers off! I don't get it & I can see a LOT of lawsuits & the passengers getting rich off of this!


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Posted: 2/14/2013 5:13:56 PM
Do you really think Mobile is large enough to have 1,500 hotel rooms free? Even a 500 room hotel is a pretty large hotel.

Tugs are typically only found in ports that need them. Ships at Cozumel all dock at a pier so, no tugs. Ships coming into (typically) river ports (like the port of Houston) have to use tugs. I imagine those tugs came from Veracruz. As for why they didn't transfer them to other ships. Umm, there's not just empty ships cruising around the Gulf or even at port. Large ships cost money, they have their cargo and routes laid out well in advance. Also, you'd be surprised at just how few crew (and that means accomodations) are on even a huge shipping vessels. Ship to ship transfer and even having to load life boats are not 100% safe operations. That's why they are reserved for emergencies. Our paper said that before the tugs could arrive the ship drifted with the currents further north making Mobile the same distance as Progresso. Given the 900 or so onboard without passports (don't even get me started on that) they decided to head to Mobile. I imagine the fact that Mobile has a shipyard played into it too.

While I feel for these people. Lets remember, there was an engine room fire on board. The fact that it was put out without the aid of professional fire fighters and without injury or loss of life is incredible. Power has been restored to parts of the ship. I'd say the crew deserves a round of applause.


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Posted: 2/14/2013 5:16:13 PM
The water has been too choppy, making the transfer of passengers too dangerous. The one evacuated woman said it was very scary transferring to another ship.

And it would have been hard to get back to Mexico because of the current. It wasn't a passport issue, it was a towing issue. The ship is not American so US coast guard is helping them at taxpayers expense, or so I've heard on CNN. Most cruise ships are registered in foreign countries because it is cheaper.






paigepea
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Posted: 2/14/2013 5:17:32 PM
Navy boats are American. The ship is foreign owned.






BrinaG
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Posted: 2/14/2013 5:21:35 PM
could you imagine if they couldn't get them all off at once? Maybe they could send boats that hold a couple of hundred passengers? How do you decide who goes first? and can you imagine the bitching and moaning that would take place among those who are last off?

An accident happened. Nobody was injured or killed. They are being given (from what I have read) a full refund and a free future cruise. I don't think anybody deserves to 'get rich off of this.'

Annabella
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Posted: 2/14/2013 5:22:09 PM
I just saw this on the news, a passenger called in and said people ran out of baby formula. I guess I missed this, so the ship has been out longer then the scheduled length of the cruise?




heather31
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Posted: 2/14/2013 5:34:15 PM
This has been a local story for us since several high school students from my dd's school are on the ship as well as several other people from the area. That question was asked this morning on our local news and the answer from the coast guard was that the weather and seas (5-7 ft) were too dangerous to transfer any passengers. It was also said that the coast guard will only assist in a medical emergency and at this point, they are only assisting in getting the ship back to land. I did just hear on our local news that someone was taken off the ship due to a stroke.



SDeven
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Posted: 2/14/2013 5:52:20 PM
I'm sure there are many reasons why that would be a very last resort...not the least of which it's incredibly dangerous (even in the calmest waters), time-consuming, expensive and just getting the appropriate manpower and gear needed to transfer that many people off would be crazy.

It's a difficult situation, to be sure, but so far, not life-threatening.

You can't put *that* many people on a helicopter at once, which would mean multiple aircraft with multiple teams of highly trained personnel...running back and forth many many times from the ship to the nearest land. Plus if all those highly trained people are deployed to this non-emergency, what happens if there's a real emergency they can't get to?

Going from the deck of a listing ship to a hovering helicopter is no picnic. It's scary as heck. I bet when push came to shove alot of passengers would freak at the prospect of doing that, if faced with the option in a non-emergency situation.

Unless the ship was going down, evacuation would probably be a far more dangerous operation than anyone wants to encounter.

Tugs aren't generally equipped for passengers. Tender boats aren't equipped for long hauls.

You really can't just pull a second ship up beside her and throw a rope ladder across, in the middle of the ocean, lest they be slammed together. The Triumph weighs about 100,000 tons. Bumping into her, even lighty, would not be pretty.






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Posted: 2/14/2013 6:09:13 PM
Getting thousands of people off a ship out in the ocean is beyond complicated. I'm sure that the authorities have thought of all possibilities and come up with the most workable solution.


An accident happened. Nobody was injured or killed. They are being given (from what I have read) a full refund and a free future cruise. I don't think anybody deserves to 'get rich off of this.'


Yep.

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Posted: 2/14/2013 7:01:45 PM
No one will get rich off this. The contracts the passengers all signed were 6000+ words long and frees Carnival of all wrong-doing. A passenger would have to prove physical injury in order to win a lawsuit, and there haven't been any physical injuries.

Cruising is the stupidest form of travel ever invented. It's for the lazy and unadventurous. 4000 to 6000 people on one big boat is just a recipe for disaster.



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Posted: 2/14/2013 7:35:54 PM
Because there was no way the Carpathia could get there in an hour.

Fairlyoddparent
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Posted: 2/14/2013 7:52:03 PM

Cruising is the stupidest form of travel ever invented. It's for the lazy and unadventurous. 4000 to 6000 people on one big boat is just a recipe for disaster.


I'm lazy and unadventurous then because I love cruising.



melissa
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Posted: 2/14/2013 7:56:04 PM
Remember the post here not too long ago asking about whether you really should have a passport or not on a cruise?

It's not required when you leave from and return to an American port (there may be more details that I do not recall).

This would have been a huge issue for passengers without passports had they been towed to Mexico or had boats been able to come pick them up and take them to Mexico.




sues
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Posted: 2/14/2013 7:58:41 PM

Lets remember, there was an engine room fire on board. The fact that it was put out without the aid of professional fire fighters and without injury or loss of life is incredible. Power has been restored to parts of the ship. I'd say the crew deserves a round of applause.
Wait- who is slamming the crew? I didn't see any of that on this thread.

Nantini
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Posted: 2/14/2013 8:01:18 PM
I loathe Carnival.

Yeah, I know some just love it but in the cruise world it's low end. This ship was one that should have been put out to pasture years ago. I'm sad that those people are stuck. No one deserves that. I hope they compensate people accordingly, and have heard they are doing just that. But people that think they'll get rich off their inconvenience have another thing coming.

I remember when people saved for years for cruises. Carnivals made it easy and affordable for the masses. With that comes all kinds of cost cutting measures.

I'm sure they don't have the manpower to send another ship to their rescue. There wasn't a fire, so there would have been no need for the coast guard. They're at the mercy of the cruise lines.

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Posted: 2/14/2013 8:12:18 PM
They have reported that at sea transfers are very dangerous and that is why doing a transfer would only be done as a last resort.

In addition to the dangers of the actual transfer itself, there have been very high winds and rough seas, which would make a transfer even more dangerous.





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Posted: 2/14/2013 8:20:47 PM


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Posted: 2/14/2013 8:29:16 PM

Cruising is the stupidest form of travel ever invented. It's for the lazy and unadventurous. 4000 to 6000 people on one big boat is just a recipe for disaster.


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Posted: 2/14/2013 8:31:33 PM

The Triumph weighs about 100 tons. Bumping into her, even lighty, would not be pretty.


It's over 100,000 tons.


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Posted: 2/14/2013 8:40:29 PM

Because there was no way the Carpathia could get there in an hour.






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Posted: 2/14/2013 8:42:24 PM
Transfers at sea are very dangerous with calm seas. The Navy doesn't like doing them with trained personnel. I could not even fathom the danger of trying to transfer 4000 untrained individuals in heavy seas.


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Posted: 2/14/2013 8:44:04 PM
"I just saw this on the news, a passenger called in and said people ran out of baby formula. I guess I missed this, so the ship has been out longer then the scheduled length of the cruise?"

The cruise was supposed to be back on Sunday, 2/10.
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Posted: 2/14/2013 8:47:52 PM
They were talking about it today. The waters are really choppy and a small boat bouncing along side a stationary object and people transfer across rope ladders would be a disaster. They cannot use the gang planks for the same reason. It was very dangerous for the people they took on board to try and help already and they were trained to do at seas transfers.


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Posted: 2/14/2013 8:54:34 PM

Do you really think Mobile is large enough to have 1,500 hotel rooms free? Even a 500 room hotel is a pretty large hotel.

Yes, I do. Particularly if they were booked when they first decided to head to Mobile. I think I even saw the mayor or someone on tv saying that Mobile had plenty of rooms.

According to the Mobile convention bureau, there are over 7000 rooms in the area.


We're kind of a big deal.The Mobile Bay Convention Center is the belle of the city. Situated along the waterfront, it's a contemporary facility with 317,000 square feet of space, including a 100,000 square-foot Exhibit Hall. And as far as people go, the convention center sales and service staff are as well prepared and seasoned as the gumbo they serve. Just a bead's throw away, it's surrounded by over 1,100 4-star and value-based hotel rooms – a total of 7,000 rooms throughout the city.



I'd much rather sit on a disabled cruise ship and wait a month for it to be towed into a port, than disembark at sea whether by smaller boats or by helicopter.




melanell
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Posted: 2/14/2013 9:01:40 PM
I asked the same thing, and DH reminded me that the liability involved in something so potentially dangerous would be astronomical.



mebarnet
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Posted: 2/14/2013 9:06:39 PM
Another stupid and unadverterous person here as I a,so love to cruise. It is very relaxing, my whole family loves to cruise.

Granted, I would never again get onto a Carnival ship but issues can happen with any line. I prefer to pay the extra money and go on Disney. While they are registered outside the US like the other ships. They do have an obviously large US reputation to uphold. The ships are always clean and the service top notch.

With regard to the Pea who mentioned helicopters, not on,y would that be more time consuming and dangerous than an at sea transfer, military helicopters don't hold as many people as you would think. It would take quite awhile to remove all the passengers, the crew would have to remain on board even with several dozen helicopters. My ex is an Army helicopter pilot.

If there were an emergency, the Coast Guard and other military units would step in and start removing the passengers. I understand the conditions are horrible but that isn't an emergency unfortunately for those on board.


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BuckeyeSandy
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Posted: 2/14/2013 9:07:48 PM

Because there was no way the Carpathia could get there in an hour.


(Only if this was being said by the Dowager Duchess )

LOL not sure if many others caught it, that was't nice but it is funny (for this situation)


This situation is why I personally do not like ships that are so very big.


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Posted: 2/14/2013 9:08:43 PM

Yeah, I know some just love it but in the cruise world it's low end. This ship was one that should have been put out to pasture years ago.


How many years (or miles?) do cruise ships typically last?


Teresa

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Posted: 2/14/2013 11:01:55 PM
Why risk other lives to save people when they are not in immediate danger.
I hope lots of people took paperback books instead of their Kindles and Nooks so they can read and share books to pass time during the day. You know there are all kinds of ways people can entertain themselves to pass the time. I hope some of these people have been wilderness camping so they can lead games or something. lol. When we went on a cruise (Carnival)..it was nice enough. We didn't expect royalty treatment. We knew it wasn't one of the more costly cruises. We were treated very ,very well. I know the sewage problem is probably beyond awful,,,don't eat so much and you won't go so much. ( I know they have food being brought in.)
These people have food and water...are probably not going to die, so need to be grateful they didn't burn to death and will have vacation story to tell for the rest of their lives. I wish the people on the ship well and hope nothing else goes wrong.
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