My thoughts on the TOU sticky......

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Posted 3/1/2013 by *kaleidoscope* in General Scrappin'
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*kaleidoscope*
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Posted: 3/1/2013 4:32:28 PM
I fully understand this is a store. I get that, I really do. You're a business.
But at the same time it irks me when no one is supposed to allude* in any way whatsoever things being sold anywhere else. Some of us don't really shop online. And some of us really aren't in the know about manufacturer brands and don't follow all that stuff. I never would have known about the MLS warehouse sale last year if someone didn't post it and I would have missed out on all those alphabet stickers that I have fallen in with.

I know, you're a business and don't care. But competition is actually a good thing. It forces you to provide better prices and better service.


Hey, grammar peas, I looked that one up to make sure I was using the right one.



Gem Girl
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Posted: 3/1/2013 4:35:58 PM
Yet the word "to" following "whatsoever" seems to have eluded you.

Sorry, I couldn't resist....


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*kaleidoscope*
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Posted: 3/1/2013 4:39:06 PM
aw, crap!



Gem Girl
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Posted: 3/1/2013 4:41:38 PM
Sokay, use done tole em purdy gud anywhose. LOL


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smcl
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Posted: 3/1/2013 4:43:05 PM
Sorry, all in fun, but I think it should be: It's a business.
... Not quite sure, though.


~Susan






*kaleidoscope*
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Posted: 3/1/2013 5:02:36 PM
hmmm... Well, the business is made up of people so I'm going with 'you'.



alisonleigh21
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Posted: 3/1/2013 5:11:48 PM
y'all are too much!!

I agree!


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tiffanyo
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Posted: 3/1/2013 5:27:59 PM

I love the peas.

And for what it is worth, I agree. I thought I was done buying 5th and Frolic, then found something from the line somewhere *ahem* and promptly tossed a few more items into my pea bucket to use along with it. And then I needed more to hit free shipping, so there you go.
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futuredoc
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Posted: 3/1/2013 5:30:44 PM
Lol at you all

But seriously, I agree that it is not the smartest thing to prohibit mentions of other stores. It is pretty crazy to do that even for products that Two Peas doesn't sell!

This is their site, their business and their forums, so they can make the rules, of course. That said, I think the best way to gain and keep customers is by offering competitive pricing and great customer service on the products people want.

Of course, I do shop here sometimes and will continue to, I'm sure, and I doubt I will go around violating the TOU Even so, I don't think it's necessarily the best practice to ban all mentions of other stores.


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hilsmom
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Posted: 3/1/2013 5:56:29 PM
Not only that, but where does the handslapping stop? What about peas who post about die cutting machines? Those are die cuts and alpha stickers that are NOT being purchased from the store because we are making them at home. What about Frozen Peas? Or stash-using peas? All of those threads discourage shopping, don't they? Any posts about kit clubs? Scraproom organization? I mean, the sticky does ask that you don't even post about things 2peas doesn't carry. And anyone who is a design team member for a product 2peas doesn't carry shouldn't discuss anything here about that, even though it might inspire one of us to shop here and buy a similar product.

Now take a look at the first page of posts, and mentally eliminate all the threads that violate the TOU. Then we can sing along together in our very best caroling voices..."It's beginning to look a lot like Cricut..."


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He**inWA
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Posted: 3/1/2013 6:03:15 PM

the sticky does ask that you don't even post about things 2peas doesn't carry.

yeah, and that sucks.
It also doesn't give twopeas an idea of what we're buying elsewhere that they could add to inventory.
Makes no sense to me.

I agree...having conversation censored in that manner does not make a useful board, encourage scrapping, or draw traffic to their store.
Also makes me wonder if there is another change in ownership in the future.

JMO



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Jjmikrut143
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Posted: 3/1/2013 6:05:20 PM
I think some of the rules jamie pointed out in the sticky are fair and I also think some are unfair.. Just like you mentioned about warehouse sales or items at big box stores, I don't think we should be banned from posting about those kinda things.. If twopeas doesn't carry the items then why would it matter.. In theory they aren't losing any business over it because they can't sell an item they don't have..

I completely understand people posting things like come check out this site they are cheaper and better then twopeas.. Yea that's wrong!! There's also a lot of peas that only use the boards and don't shop here for whatever reasons they have.. So for a pea to come on and create a post Asking where can they find a product that twopeas clearly sells, then I feel like thats completely wrong! After all twopeasinabucket.com isn't a social networking site like facebook would be..it's a store!



Jennifer

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Posted: 3/1/2013 6:08:41 PM
I don't shop here (or anywhere online) so I would have absolutely no idea what there is or is not in stock for me to talk about (or not).

I appreciate that the message board is free and I understand that they have to run a business but I'd rather pay a nominal user fee here than to put up with that kind of a TOU. So now I have to do a search through their store before I can ask if such-and-such a trimmer is a good one or not???

hilsmom
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Posted: 3/1/2013 6:12:22 PM

I completely understand people posting things like come check out this site they are cheaper and better then twopeas.. Yea that's wrong!! There's also a lot of peas that only use the boards and don't shop here for whatever reasons they have.. So for a pea to come on and create a post Asking where can they find a product that twopeas clearly sells, then I feel like thats completely wrong! After all twopeasinabucket.com isn't a social networking site like facebook would be..it's a store!


I totally agree. But I also take into consideration that some peas post layouts here but don't shop here. Looking at their stuff in the gallery can easily inspire another pea to use a product they have used, and to buy it from here.


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*kaleidoscope*
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Posted: 3/1/2013 6:13:33 PM

I completely understand people posting things like come check out this site they are cheaper and better then twopeas..


I agree... that would be different.



stwa
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Posted: 3/1/2013 6:21:11 PM
I can understand why they've posted the sticky - I've seen heaps of posts lately like 'so and so has a sale' or 'free shipping for so and so' and I don't think that's right.

As for not talking about products that 2peas don't sell... what about sillouette cuts? Cricut? Canon selphy? Cameras/printers etc?? I do understand not talking about brands that compete with what is offered at 2peas though.

Also, this thread is hard to follow... I think some of the comments have been deleted


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peapermint
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Posted: 3/1/2013 6:46:46 PM

the sticky does ask that you don't even post about things 2peas doesn't carry.


There would be a lot of posts deleted about the Allison Davis (Scrapbook Generation) sketch books. Those are the ONLY reason I started shopping at the other big online store for some stuff. They carry them while Two Peas does not.

But I always shop Two Peas first. I've been loyal here since 1999.

theshyone
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Posted: 3/1/2013 6:52:08 PM
They openly encourage the buy and sell board though. Totally a double standard. That board definitely takes away from people buying new in the store. Makes no sense.

I've also been wondering when the Ikea threads would get deleted, as they are in competition.


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Posted: 3/1/2013 7:17:18 PM
I understand their point, I hope they enforce it with the kit club threads too.

Momof3Pits
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Posted: 3/1/2013 7:36:12 PM
This is what I posted on another thread when the sticky was brought up:

"Wow, just read the new stickie. My only response is...

I would hope that 2peas would have enough confidence in their store, products, and prices that they wouldn't feel threatened by someone trying to share awesome deals at TJMaxx. Kinda bums me out and brings down the spirit of this place, IMHO."

And I wanted to share it here as well because I liked my wording!!


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shawnlyn72
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Posted: 3/1/2013 7:47:16 PM
so, having said that, aren't they violating their OWN TOU when all the videos their own people post on their own site contain product that isn't even available for purchase yet?

aerynkelly13
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Posted: 3/1/2013 7:49:35 PM
I must be reading it wrong.

Examples were given of a very specific nature. Pictures and subjects pertaining to the promotion of another STORE. "M's has this real cheap!"

The "I realize that you may be speaking about something that Two Peas doesn't carry" bit came AFTER all that. Implying sentences like "M's has their brand of storage really cheap, go get it!" is not allowed.

It seems more the sticky is "Do not mention other stores in any way". SO, if I'm reading it correctly: "I really enjoy my cube storage." or "The Canon Selphy is a great product" is fine as long as you're not saying "The Canon Selphy found at xyz.com is really great" is not allowed.

Y/N?


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biochemipea
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Posted: 3/1/2013 7:51:39 PM

It seems more the sticky is "Do not mention other stores in any way". SO, if I'm reading it correctly: "I really enjoy my cube storage." or "The Canon Selphy is a great product" is fine as long as you're not saying "The Canon Selphy found at xyz.com is really great" is not allowed.
I agree with you, Aeryn.






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seasonscraps
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Posted: 3/1/2013 8:04:52 PM
I can see restricting talk of any items they carry...including warehouse sales, kits and great deals at xyz store. I don't really understand why people can't discuss where to get things they do not sell at all like printers & die cut machines. But it's there board and their rules.

katybee8
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Posted: 3/1/2013 9:20:36 PM
I really think if that is what they want, it is their board.

However, I do think it a bit hypocritical if they have design team members using things that are not available in the store.

Two peas sometimes sells out of popular items and then doesn't get them back in for whatever reason.

So if they carried something, a design team member used it and linked it and then it was unavailable and someone said, "Hey! I found that great washi that so and so used in her layout and you can get it at _____" that would be considered a violation. Crazy.

If it's something they have never sold, like electronic die cutting machines, I don't see the big deal, either. If it's because they "might" sell it, well, after they start selling it, they can enforce the TOU.


SDeven
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Posted: 3/1/2013 9:30:08 PM
I love twopeas...and will respect their rules. I shop here a bit and have always received excellent service.






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Posted: 3/1/2013 9:46:49 PM
I don't get out much, so I am sad that I won't hear about good deals from M's J's, and HL anymore. Those have really helped my extremely small scrapping budget.


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KBPea
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Posted: 3/1/2013 10:08:07 PM
I'm not that upset about it. I'm guessing they have (wisely) made the restrictions very broad so that if they pull a thread people have less reason to get up in arms about it; after all, it's in the TOU. I don't think they have been or will be enforcing it to the fullest extent that they could. It's sort of a like a law against jaywalking. We have those laws to discourage people from jaywalking, even though they are rarely enforced, and if it becomes a problem then we have the rules in place to support efforts to stop it. Two Peas doesn't seem to typically pull these threads, but if it becomes really egregious they can and no one can say they didn't have notice.

Simply_Lovely
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Posted: 3/1/2013 10:13:06 PM
On one hand I see your points. But on the other it seems like this board has turned into kit-club central lately. Every other thread is either a complaint about SC, praise for CT or CD. Questions about Gossamer Blue or something else similar. Those clubs have their own boards, so why can't people discuss kit issues there???? I don't care if you cancelled your SC PL subscription or didn't get an add-on, or your Citrus Twist kit was perfectly packaged. Do.Not.Care.




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stwa
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Posted: 3/1/2013 10:20:25 PM

I'm not that upset about it. I'm guessing they have (wisely) made the restrictions very broad so that if they pull a thread people have less reason to get up in arms about it; after all, it's in the TOU. I don't think they have been or will be enforcing it to the fullest extent that they could. It's sort of a like a law against jaywalking.
Two Peas doesn't seem to typically pull these threads, but if it becomes really egregious they can and no one can say they didn't have notice.

Good point


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Rhonda in TX
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Posted: 3/1/2013 10:53:46 PM
Am I understanding this correctly? We are allowed to ask about products (even non-2 peas products), but not allowed to mention where they can be bought? Is that the idea? So, I could ask for opinions on different brands of something like 3-ring binders, but can't ask where the best place to buy it is (even if 2 peas doesn't sell these binders). I guess google is your friends in these situations.

If I'm misunderstanding, please let me know.


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StoryAngel
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Posted: 3/1/2013 10:57:04 PM
So I'm guessing this includes all the Project Life branded products, like the core kits...? Even if you're potentially going to mix them with something from the 2 Peas store?


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CreativeEngineer
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Posted: 3/1/2013 11:13:32 PM
This board is going to get really boring really fast if they strictly enforce those TOU.





Fevvers
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Posted: 3/1/2013 11:37:44 PM

I do think it a bit hypocritical if they have design team members using things that are not available in the store.

Two Peas sometimes sells out of popular items and then doesn't get them back in for whatever reason.


Because our GG projects are done weeks in advance, we can never know for sure what will and won't be in stock. If ever a supply is used that isn't carried in the store (such as paint or gel medium, for instance), you will never hear one of us say, "Go get it at xyz."

I support the TOU. It makes clear that talking about products is fine; talking about places to buy them other than Two Peas is not. It's only fair. Two Peas is a business and a community. Threads filled with mentions of go-there-to-buy-this may seem helpful to individuals, but they could have a negative impact on the business, and by extension, the community, in the long run.



Justlulu
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Posted: 3/2/2013 12:42:26 AM
Jjmikrut143 The terms of use were updated before CHA, so no it has nothing to do with when 2P's received the AC product. Trust me, if it could be law that the product arrives here first it would be! I don't think it's fair to place fault at 2P's for the product not arriving here first.

As Garden Girls we do our best to promote product sold in the shop, and try to predict what will be there, but its not always possible. I hope people use the "request and notify" button. It's a wonderful tool to help 2Ps know there is still a demand for a product, and for you to know the moment it hits the shelves.


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Posted: 3/2/2013 1:00:19 AM
As someone who visits the forum for ideas, etc. (the forum made me aware of the Glitter Girl videos, which made me aware of Washi tape), I appreciate what I learn here.

I don't buy online. If I did, I would definitely shop here, but the worst credit card fraud I dealt with came from an online purchase, and I haven't bought anything online since. I also need to see things up close and personal. Colors on the screen are not always true to colors IRL.

Having said that, I have NO problem it's the TOU, even though I don't shop here. Their site, their rules. We can still learn and share a lot even abiding by the TOU.

Maybe someday I'll get brave enough to try shopping online again, and if I do, I'll start with Two Peas. After all, I've enjoyed the message board here for years.


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Jo_boyce23
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Posted: 3/2/2013 2:34:18 AM
What is TOU?


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RnKMom
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Posted: 3/2/2013 3:29:05 AM

I mean, the sticky does ask that you don't even post about things 2peas doesn't carry.
So, we're meant to check first what the store has before deciding if we can post about it? Sounds very time-consuming when you're jumping on and off quickly.

And can you imagine this board WITHOUT Black Friday posts? The beauty of this place is seeing exactly where in each store a particular item is located and the price it's going for. It's been great here on the West Coast to hear from the East Coasters 3 hours ahead of what's out there.



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DinCA
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Posted: 3/2/2013 4:14:56 AM
Maybe Jamie can jump in here to clarify this, but I understand the TOU to mean that you may discuss any item you want as long as you don't direct anyone to another place to purchase it, whether it's sold at Two Peas or not.

It's not meant to discourage discussion or reviews of any product.


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Posted: 3/2/2013 4:20:32 AM
Jo_boyce23, TOU is Terms Of Use, the agreement you make by using this site. Most web sites have a check button that you have to check saying "I agree" when you sign up (and one for their Privacy Policy, as well). Few users read them, and the terms can change without notice to the users, but the terms are generally reasonable if one considers the perspective of the business that is operating the site. HTH That stands for Hope This Helps.


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jenp1024
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Posted: 3/2/2013 4:38:25 AM
While I agree with the spirit of the TOU, if I'm reading them correctly, the are incredibly restrictive. We can't mention a product they don't carry, even if no mention is made of where to buy said product?

That would eliminate all PL discussions, use of die cutting machines, idea books, storage solutions, etc.

I totally understand not mentioning another store;in my opinion that's just common sense. But the product bit is over the top, in my opinion.


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LovMelrose
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Posted: 3/2/2013 8:26:19 AM
So if I understand correctly it is still ok to post something like hey everyone - I just got and awesome deal on XYZ! Then peas can peamail or email for more info as to where?

As long as you don't mention where you're ok!


Patty


aJerseyGirl
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Posted: 3/2/2013 8:33:27 AM
I agree with aerynkelly and the others who have said that their interpretation is that you can post about any product even those not sold at Two Peas as long as other stores are not discussed. So you do not have to do a search on a certain trimmer to see if Two Peas sells it before you can ask a question about it.

For products that Two Peas does not sell, I believe it is fair to require that you don't discuss the stores where you can get them. We have a certain amount of scrapping dollars to spend. Of course Two Peas would like to get as many of those dollars as possible. So why would they want to allow peas to talk about spending money elsewhere even on products they don't carry? I think any business would do the same. It is their business that pays for the free message board.

I gets lots of valuable information from the peas beyond where to buy things. If all posts regarding stores are removed, there would still be an abundance of great information, thoughts and opinions being shared here.

I've had great experiences purchasing from 2 Peas so I will respect their TOU and not post about the great deal I got at Abc store.


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*kaleidoscope*
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Posted: 3/2/2013 8:42:21 AM

So if I understand correctly it is still ok to post something like hey everyone - I just got and awesome deal on XYZ! Then peas can peamail or email for more info as to where?

As long as you don't mention where you're ok!


Nope.... they don't want peamail going around either. Of course, it says not to say 'peamail me' about the deal but that doesn't mean someone isn't going to do it on their own accord. I don't think they want you to even say 'wow, I just got a great bargain' even in excitement. Because that could lead to other things.


The free message board we offer is a place to connect and discuss scrapbooking with other crafters.


It was a business tactic, plain and simple. People like to socialize. Give them a place to get together and they might buy stuff from your store. That's why there's little cafes at book stores and free internet at fast food and coffee shops. Economics 101 - there's no such thing as a free lunch.



shawnlyn72
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Posted: 3/2/2013 8:45:28 AM
I wasn't trying to find fault with the Garden Girls, really I wasn't. I just meant it as an example that even though the TOU as they are written have the potential to be EXTREMELY restrictive, it doesn't seem like it's strictly enforced to the letter. For me, it means I'll do my best to comply with what I think their intentions actually are, and hope for the best. And if a board or comment gets deleted, so be it.

*kaleidoscope*
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Posted: 3/2/2013 8:56:15 AM
And some people might never even try certain products if it weren't for someone saying something like 'I was able to get some washi super cheap at a B&M store'. Especially those who weren't really interested in the product in the first place. But that juicy little tidbit reeled them in to give it a whirl.

That MLS warehouse sale. Never would have gotten it (or known about it) and when it was posted what the person received (because hearing about a warehouse sale isn't going to do a thing for me) I was willing to take my chances that my box would have a ton of letter stickers like hers did. And the company included a little catalog that shows their products. Which I looked at in this store and I'd even consider ordering - except that I've heard the shipping is really high. Not spending $50 to get free shipping though. *sigh*



Sophikins
StuckOnPeas

PeaNut 62,725
January 2003
Posts: 2,143
Layouts: 71
Loc: Pacific NW

Posted: 3/2/2013 9:35:04 AM
I have to admit the tone of the TOU strictness reminds me of how PC drove customers away when they came down on the software developers.

Making TOU that will drive people (read- potential customers) AWAY from your site seems to be poor business sense. The only sale you will never get is the one from someone who is no longer visiting your website. I love this message board, but I sure won't spend my time here if it becomes so censored that it is essentially only like an ad for Two Peas.


M
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ScrapNatya
Is this an instrument of torture or communication?

PeaNut 1,583
October 1999
Posts: 9,669
Layouts: 476
Loc: Long Island

Posted: 3/2/2013 9:40:39 AM
I think Two Peas has a right to set up terms of use for what they deem appropriate topics on their message board. It's really not hard to discuss the merits of an item with out talking about where you bought it. Everything is just a google search away.


Marianne
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
My Youtube channel

in the moment


Learnin2Scrap01
Will I ever get to Buckethead?!

PeaNut 453,841
January 2010
Posts: 406
Layouts: 29
Loc: Happily scrappin with my stash

Posted: 3/2/2013 9:43:12 AM

Then we can sing along together in our very best caroling voices..."It's beginning to look a lot like Cricut..."

hilsmom
Professional Hobbyist

PeaNut 292,577
January 2007
Posts: 5,245
Layouts: 51
Loc: In the deep-fried south.

Posted: 3/2/2013 9:52:15 AM

I think Two Peas has a right to set up terms of use for what they deem appropriate topics on their message board. It's really not hard to discuss the merits of an item with out talking about where you bought it. Everything is just a google search away.


And they are asking that you not encourage that either.

From the sticky:


I realize some posts are made about product that we do not carry or currently have in stock. We ask that you still not make posts of this nature. If you are unsure if your post complies with our Terms of Use, just ask yourself if what you are wanting to share would encourage a reader to click away from Two Peas or to spend their scrapping budget elsewhere. If so, we ask that you not share it.




A google search would encourage a pea to click away from the site, yes?


I do wish they would treat us like hounds. Let us run on the scent of something, but trust that we WILL come back.


Happiness looks good on everyone!
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